Nero vom Nöbachtal

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German Shepherd Dog - maleMale

VA5 Nero vom Nöbachtal 

 Kkl 1 

Sire Born: 01. February 2001

VA5 Nero vom Nöbachtal

SZ  2080775
Hip: SV: HD a-normal (a1) - Elbows: SV: HD a-normal (a1)
DNA: Gelagert
Tattoo: R-B 1228
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Breed report

Groß, kräftig, typvoll mit sehr gutem Pigment und sehr gutem Gebäudeverhältnis. Sehr guter Kopf, hoher Widerrist, gute Rückenlinie und sehr gute Kruppe. Sehr gute Winkelungen, ausgewogene Brustverhältnisse, korrekte Front. Geradegehend zeigt er kraftvolle Gänge mit sehr guter Schrittweite. Wesen sicher, TSB ausgeprägt; läßt ab.





VA4 Enzo von Buchhorn SchH3 male

SZ 1930146
HD-SV: HD a-normal (a1)
VA4 Enzo von Buchhorn

Groß, sehr kraft- und gehaltvoll, viel Typ und Ausdruck. Beste Gebäudeverhältnisse, sehr trocken und fest. Vorbildliche Oberlinie mit langer, sehr gut gelagerter Kruppe. Sehr gute Winkelungen der Vor- und Hinterhand, korrekte Brustverhältnisse, gerade Front, gerade Schritt- und Trittfolge. Sehr kraftvolle, raumschaffende Gänge mit wirksamem Nachschub und freiem Vortritt. Sicheres Wesen, Härte, Mut und Kampftrieb ausgeprägt; Hund läßt ab.


VA1 BSZS 1997 Lasso vom Neuen Berg SchH3 male

SZ 1820256 (AKC DL71755501)
HD-SV: HD a-normal (a1)
VA1 BSZS 1997 Lasso vom Neuen Berg


V1 Folemarkens Jasso SCHH3, IPO1, BHP1 male

DKK 29122/88 (SZ 1801620)
HD-SV: HD a-fast normal (a2)
V1 Folemarkens Jasso


V Eike vom Neuen Berg SchH2 female

SZ 1740742

V Tina vom Lechtal SchH2 female

SZ 1818219
HD-SV: HD a-normal (a1)
V Tina vom Lechtal


V23 Nilo von Adeloga SCHH3, HGH male

SZ 1734069
HD-SV: HD a-normal (a1)
V23 Nilo von Adeloga


V2 VA4(A) Susi vom Lechtal SCHH3, FH female

SZ 1744538
HD-SV: HD a-fast normal (a2)
V2 VA4(A) Susi vom Lechtal


V Angie von den Amperauen SCHH1 female

SZ 1997769
HD-SV: HD a-normal (a1)

Groß, mittelkräftig, typvoll, trocken und fest. Hoher Widerrist, gerader Rücken, gute Lage und noch gute Länge der Kruppe, gute Winkelungen der Vor- und Hinterhand. Korrekte Front, ausgeglichene Brustverhältnisse, vorne und hinten gering enggehend, kraftvolle Gänge mit sehr guter Schrittweite. Sicheres Wesen, TSB ausgeprägt; läßt ab.


VA1 BSZS 2001 Ursus von Batu SchH3 male

SZ 1932624
HD-SV: HD a-normal (a1)
VA1 BSZS 2001 Ursus von Batu


VA1(I) Hobby vom Gletschertopf SCHH3 male

SZ 1859356
HD-SV: HD a-normal (a1)
VA1(I) Hobby vom Gletschertopf


V Verena von Batu SCHH2 female

SZ 1834230
HD-SV: HD a-normal (a1)

V Dendi vom Haus Schalk SchH2 female

SZ 1884028
HD-SV: HD a-normal (a1)
V Dendi vom Haus Schalk


V Unto vom Loher-Stein SchH3 male

SZ 1811667
HD-fast normal
V Unto vom Loher-Stein


V Asteria Pfalzgraf Johann SchH1 female

SZ 1795067
HD-fast normal

Picture galleries

User comments

German Lover
Posted: Sat Apr 11, 2015 09:23 am
I love Nero. We bought Nilo son of Falko who comes from the son of Nero, Solo Von Team Fiemerek.

Nilo is a naif boy three years old who lives with us in the countryside of Tuscia originally called the very south of Tuscany.

He is an incredible dog and the appearence is incredibly close to Nero. We have never got him in competition even if the first owner make something.

We have a life togheter with him and in our family there are other German Shepherd, Greta the wife of Nilo and Mia the daughter of Nilo and Greta.

Living with Nilo we can daily understood the quality of Nero and his genealogy.
GSD Lineage
GSD Lineage
Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2014 10:02 pm

VA5 Nero vom Nöbachtal video from

Uploaded on Mar 10, 2009 by Enkhbayar Chuluunbaatar

Gaihaltai nohoi shuu Nero vom Nobachtal VA5-2003

Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 02:16 pm
Hi, where is Nero now?, there are puppies sons of him? Please tell me about please!
Thanks and Best regards.
Posted: Sat May 21, 2011 05:58 pm
I have a Nero son and he is AWESOME.... He has great temperment,drives,structure,pigment--he is truly a sight to behold !!!! I know I will never own another one like him !!!
Chennai Arun
Chennai Arun
Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2011 06:29 pm
Absolutely I Agree with shepherdace bcas of Nero's progeny Banned in Germany We got a legend like V1 Sammo team Fiemereck to India
Myself got a Grand Daughter of Nero and hats off to Legendary Nero Nobachtal

with regards,
S. Arun Kumar
Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2011 12:23 pm
Nero's prelude to fame will be as a producer extrodinaire.A dog banned from breeding in Germany who is now making a come back through his grand kids and great grand kids.It was an initial loss when he was banned from breeding in Augast 2004.I suppose the SV had no choice but the smart breeders used his sons and daughters and among his famous decendants are VAs Shicco, Arex,Zara,Dara, Chayenne and
SG2 Omen Radhaus to name a few.Believe it or not there will be more to come.As they say better late than never to add super breed type to a breeding programme.
Posted: Thu May 20, 2010 07:21 pm
Wyświetl tekst transliterowany na alfabet łaciński
cool dog! one of the most beautiful German Shepherd and a very good producer!! I do not know who depended on the destruction of his career, rumors of some glumimi elbow ,,,,,,,,!!!!
Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 04:37 am
Can anyone please give me the contact number or email of the owner of this beautiful dog
Posted: Wed Jan 16, 2008 07:20 am
Viski vom Lesars Hof is for sale.

Pedigre, pictures and progeny pictures available at:

For more info contact me at:
Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2008 05:50 pm
does anyone knows of a nero nobachtal son for sale???
pasupuleti suresh
Posted: Thu Sep 13, 2007 04:41 pm
Germany's loss is the worlds gain. By banning Nero and his progeny, the shepherd lovers of the world got a golden opportunity and access to a fantastic gene pool of a super VA dog and a super producer. His progeny - Sammo, Solo, Campino, Sambessy etc have proved themselves without a doubt. If he had remained in Germany we in the rest of the world would have had to be happy with the very ordinary lines or the last pick in the litters.
Posted: Wed Sep 12, 2007 09:14 pm
Considering the large amount of excellent Nero offspring and the demand for the Nero males,,,,I'm not sure the breed was best served by banning SOME of his progeny.
Ron Hudson
Ron Hudson
Posted: Tue Sep 11, 2007 06:53 pm
The SV made the correct decision in banning Nero and his progeny. They drew a line in the sand that couldn't be crossed and in doing so upheld the integrity of the breed. Here in the USA there are often excuses for everything which makes everyone feel good but doesn't take into consideration what the long term negative effects it will have on the breed. Look at the American German Shepherd and decide for yourself if we want to go down that road.
Posted: Mon Mar 26, 2007 02:13 am
In Taiwan
Posted: Thu Apr 20, 2006 10:37 am
My name is George Stergiopoulos. I am TV reporter investigator and GSD breeder since 1999. My Zwinger name under FCI reg. 50/99 is "vom Stergland". Enzo and Nero is the males i count on for my breeding programme to evolute my breed-line. I have pups out of Enzo son Ywan v.d. Eulerstrasse, and i expect a litter at midle of May out of Campino Piste Trophe. I try to locate Nero.
Does anybody knows where is he now? I am writing an article for him and i need new photos and an interview from his owner.
Please contact me at
Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2006 10:07 am
Recently C. Lux from the SV Haupgeschafsstelle wrote an official letter about Nero to the Dutch German Shepherd Club because there was a strong rumour that he would sire some litters in Holland. C. Lux was very explicit and wrote that the "Zuchtsperre" which is on Nero since 9 August 2004 is very much valid. All progeny from Nero born after 9 October 2004 in whatever country will not be entered in the SV pedigree database, and is not allowed to enter any event organised by the SV. ------------------------------------------- The letter: Nachdem wir in Erfahrung gebracht haben, dass der Rüde Nero vom Nöbachtal in Ihrem Land als Deckrüde eingesetzt werden soll, erlauben wir uns darauf hinzuweisen, dass über diesen Hund seit 09. August 2004 Nachkommeneintragungssperre seitens des SV verhängt wurde. Folglich können Nachkommen aus diesem Hund, auch wenn sie in Ihrem Lande Eintragung ins Zuchtbuch finden würden, keine Aufnahme in unserem Zuchtbuch finden. Dies bedeutet, dass, sollten aus diesen Hunden Nachkommen zur Eintragung ins Zuchtbuch des SV angemeldet werden, dies von uns mit Hinweis auf die einschlägigen Bestimmungen abgewiesen wird. De facto bedeutet dies, dass diese Hunde ebenfalls für das deutsche Zuchtbuch mit Nachkommeneintragungssperre (Zuchtverbot) belegt sind. Um nämlich in Deutschland Hunde ins Zuchtbuch eintragen zu können, ist gemäß Ziffer 4.1.1. der Zuchtordnung notwendig, dass die Elterntiere selbst Aufnahme im Zuchtbuch des SV gefunden haben. Auch das Ausstellen solcher Hunde ist nicht möglich, da SV-seitig kein Formwert, sondern eine Zuchtbewertung vergeben wird, und gemäß der Zuchtschauordnung Hunde, die mit Nachkommeneintragungssperre belegt sind, auf Zuchtschauen des SV nicht zugelassen sind. Dies trifft auf alle Hunde zu, die von Nero vom Nöbachtal nach Eintritt der Nachkommeneintragungssperre gezeugt wurden. Wir wären Ihnen dankbar, wenn Sie sich entschließen könnten, ebenfalls Nachkommeneintragungssperre zu verhängen, da dies zum Schutze der Hündinnenbesitzer sicherlich opportun wäre. Mit freundlichem Gruß, C. Lux -----------------------------------------
Posted: Fri Nov 04, 2005 05:23 pm
Yeah, Whats the name of this dog? I don't think its Campino. His owner told me that he is not for sale, and that was before this year's Sieger Show. Looking at his position at that show, I think its definately not Campino. He is way too valuable right now to be put on sale.
Posted: Fri Nov 04, 2005 04:29 am
Ok and who would this Nero son be that is expected to be the next USA Sieger?
The top rated son from Nero was Solo this year he made V14. Is he sold to the USA?
Or do you mean the other high ranked son Campino.
Posted: Thu Nov 03, 2005 06:32 pm
I just want to know where he is now. Is he still being bred from?? His legacy will definately live on, especially through Campino and Sammo. Both very good dogs.
Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 06:25 pm
Does anyone know where and who owns him now? Sad that such a great dog should fall into oblivion.
Posted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 12:27 pm
Carl Aranda has DENIED he is isg - are we not surprised?

isg U 5 Hassenkam's Hassan - 30 August 2004 - 12:08

could someone confirm this dogs date of birth, I dont believe this is a son of Luck von Batu

Carl Aranda
Owner of Luck von batu

Posted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 07:44 am
Nero of children have no more breed prohibition.
That is very, very good.
Posted: Thu Oct 14, 2004 11:26 pm
Posted: Wed Oct 06, 2004 09:47 am
The picture of Sämmo vom Team Fiemereck is not Sämmo it is his brother SOLO on top of the progeny-group of Nero in Karlsruhe!
Posted: Tue Oct 05, 2004 09:54 am
VA5 NERO in Taiwan now, He is so happy that is still like as king.
Posted: Tue Oct 05, 2004 04:04 am
Thanks for your nice remarks! I agree with you 100%, it makes no sense.
Someone told me the SV has an Emergency Meeting tonight regarding the Nero offspring. I'm sure all owners and breeders are hoping for the best, including me. :o)
Posted: Tue Oct 05, 2004 02:38 am
I am genuinely shocked by the decision to ban all Nero's progeny. I considered his progeny at the 2004 Sieger Show to be second only to Yasko Farbenspiels progeny. I can think of no justification for this decision, many of his progeny are obtaining 'normal' for both HIPS & ELBOWS.
It does not make any sense to me, to say that Nero had an operation on some part of his anatomy without which he could never have been shown or obtained hid breeding qualifications, therefore let us decide to eliminate everything that he has done, including the siring of hundreds of offspring. Many hundreds of totally innocent people in our sport will SUFFER by this decision, and for what??
The SV owes it to ALL their members, and to our breed to fully explain their decision, and to explain it in several languages.
I would also appeal to them to re-consider their decision to ban Nero's progeny. I see this as totally unnecessary.
Posted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 08:04 pm
At last we have news from the SV. I am so sorry for all of you that have these beautiful dogs.
The SV does not make a choice like this without much thought so we must realize that perhaps this is for the best of our breed.
It was not right that this dog was able to make VA and sire so many litters when the Breeder knew of this prolem.
Again VA should be given when the dog has proven to be a good producer. This problem could not be a better example of why so many of us feel that giving a male without progeny VA is wrong. Had they waited to see what he would produce then he would not ever been VA and so many of you would not have Bred your top females to him.
Posted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 10:25 am
Does that effect Nero progeny sired after September 2004 or ALL progeny?
What will become of ALL of those dogs?

Suppose I owned a Nero pup (which I don’t) and I had this pup imported to the US and already registered with the AKC – will the AKC enforce/support the SV’s decision?

How did the SV learn that Nero had an Operative Eingriff?
Posted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 10:01 am
Yes the progeny is banded from breeding and showing I am a holder of an Nero-son.Is is a desaster
Posted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 11:39 pm
I just heared that from last wendsday all progency from Nero is banned from breeding and showing in the SV.
I think that`s a great shame for all these people who didn`t know about this stuff when they breed their femals to Nero.
Posted: Thu Sep 30, 2004 09:22 pm
I have no access to the Decknachrichten Data

Suppose the SV will provide more detail as to why and how they reached this decision or what was done to/with Nero?

Out of curiosity: If there is something wrong with Nero, why would anyone want to breed to him, in Taiwan or elsewhere? May I assume that if ever a dog produced out of Nero, after September 04, is brought back to Germany, he will not be eligible for registration with the SV or participation in any Show?
Who SOLD him to Taiwan?
Posted: Thu Sep 30, 2004 03:50 pm
Nero hat im Deutschland Zuchtverbot. Laut
Decknachtichten SV september 2004. Grund: Operative Eingriff. In Germany Nero is officialy excluded from breeding.
Double B
Posted: Thu Sep 30, 2004 11:54 am
Yes it`s true he has been sold to Taiwan.
Posted: Thu Sep 23, 2004 03:52 pm
Nero is in Taiwan now, and is still breeding their he shows the best progeny-group in Karlsruhe
Posted: Thu Sep 23, 2004 02:33 pm
He has got super progeny. Anybody know if he is still breeding???
Posted: Wed Sep 15, 2004 06:30 am
There's news coming tomorrow.
Posted: Tue Sep 14, 2004 11:43 pm
< Thsi is simply decking (stud) data for the previous period (month).>>

Solo.. (sigh...) I have Nero son in my club and we all feel sorry for our club member. PLEASE next time you read this "simply stud data" have a patience and read it to the end. It's right there, at the bottom of the last page. SMR already explained it... Next time I'll write my comment in German - just to make an impression on you:):):):):) If it won't sound "authorative" enough, I'll try Italian, French or Spanish. Please don't make me do it in Japanese or Korean - I don't feel comfortable enough translating "Decknarichten" in these languages :):):)
Posted: Tue Sep 14, 2004 09:06 pm
I did notice in my Decknachrichten that the dogs with HD,bite and testicle faults etc (from the SV Nachrichten des Zuchtbuchamtes) are now listed at the end of the listed stud dogs. Originally this list was in the SV magazine. I now see it both places - Decknachrichten/and SV Magazine.
The last one I have is Nr. 7.

Posted: Tue Sep 14, 2004 08:12 pm
Kati says:

"If you don't have an access to German "Decknachrichten" listen to someone who does."

Kati I have access, as do many thousands to "Deck - Nachrichten"
Thsi is simply decking (stud) data for the previous period (month).

Now you will have to quote another German 'word' in order to sound authorative.

This behaviour is akin to 'swan-necking' at road accidents, morbid curiosity, with little or no thought for those actually involved. No wonder I love DOGS.
Posted: Tue Sep 14, 2004 06:42 pm
Assuming a problem exists, I'll venture a guess, at least until the smoke clears and all the information is published. It's a technical problem. The book says this and this is what it must be.

I don't think it's a genetic issue. That's my personal opinion that I'm sure will be condescended on here. But Campino has normal hips and elbows.

I think in the end there will be two opinions of him.

He has a problem. Not a good line to have.

Or what a fantastic producer, how could we let a dog like that get away.

Maybe there is some middle ground.
Posted: Tue Sep 14, 2004 06:26 pm
Thank you to all that have given us information about this dog. I know MLT West and I trust her information.
So if his progeny will keep the right to breed ........why should he not?
If you would not breed your female to him why would you breed to his sons?
The fact that he is in China I believe answers many of our questions.
Thank you
Posted: Tue Sep 14, 2004 06:25 pm
Is this a female thing??
NOSEY, so I will make a statement to get a reaction, or go on a fishing trip?
Have some respect for Nero, the owners, the breeders, those who used Nero on their females, the Nero progeny owners.
This is NOT a little occurence at the corner shop. People and dogs are affected around the world in various ways, and to various degrees.
Speculation to get a Reaction is totally out of order.
Posted: Tue Sep 14, 2004 12:56 pm
I was on the phone to SV 5 minutes ago. They do NOT give out information over the phone, they only answer written requests by progeny OWNERS themselves...
Posted: Tue Sep 14, 2004 09:52 am
I heard Nero's progeny will NOT have their pedigree's cancelled.
Their pedigrees will stay valid.
Posted: Tue Sep 14, 2004 02:55 am
As far as I know Nero's progeny has also been banned from breeding. Even more -their pedigrees will be annuled, since they can't be entered in the SV breeding book.
What a terrible loss!!! Nero was basically my favourite dog from all the GSDs alive... Campino was the last hope...
Posted: Mon Sep 13, 2004 12:34 pm
OK, so now we know that Nero is in China.
- Can someone please tell me in layman's terms what operative Eingriff or translated to strategic intervention means?
- Does any of this news shed any light on the health of Nero?
- Do people with progeny from Nero have any possible genetic health issues to be on the look out for in the future?
- If health issues are present, how does that impact the future for Campino as a stud in relation to the future health of his progeny?
Posted: Mon Sep 13, 2004 11:04 am
SV Nachrichten 9-9-04
Nero vom Nobachtal: operative Eingriff (strategic intervention)
Posted: Mon Sep 13, 2004 08:39 am
It is a fact that Nero is in China. He shipped there last Monday and is in a great private house with a man and his family, living as a well loved pet.
Posted: Sun Sep 12, 2004 10:30 pm
After all the questions with this male I thought the Sieger Show would give us the real story. Nero would be there and we would see that it was all OK.
I was in Germany for a bit before the show and heard from a Judge that Nero was in China and that most of his progeny was for sale. He also told me Nero would not even walk with his progeny class.
Ok so he did not show up for the Sieger Show. For a male that was one the favorites last year this again is not normal. Is he in China I don't know but he was not in Germany at the Show that is.
How sad if this is all true this makes the point that Solo often makes. VA's should show a progeny before making the VA.
What a waste of breeding of such nice females to be left with this.
The owner of this dog would be wise to clear up these questions.
Posted: Sat Sep 11, 2004 08:22 am
As far as I am aware, an allegation was made about Nero, and reported to the SV. I believe an investigation was conducted, during which Nero was suspended from all activities, stud, show etc for a couple of months. It appears that the suspension was lifted sometime late June early July, because he started having many studs again at this time. I assume that a report may be produced by the SV, which hopefully clarifies this whole unfortunate episode. It certainly appears that the matter is all but over, Nero's progeny did very well at the Sieger Show, and Nero is at Stud again. It is very frustrating not knowing the full facts, and details, and of course this leads to speculation and assumption. We should wait for the SV to report on the matter, and hope that all is well for the future of this magnificent male, and his progeny, who have clearly and emphatically shown their value to the future of our breed at Karlsruhe.
Posted: Sat Sep 11, 2004 04:00 am

the Best progeny group at karlsruhe 2004 was Nero.
fantastic individuals with overall fathertype!
It was Incredible!!!

Posted: Sat Sep 11, 2004 03:09 am
He's listed as Stud on Karl Moser's Web Site, has been for a long time now.
You'd think that if anything was the matter with him, Herr Moser would indicate so or remove Nero's post.
Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 09:47 pm
David you¿re right!!! Nero had shown in Karlsruhe a TOP Progeny-Group! I think the Best Groups in Karlsruhe was Nero and Flipp.
Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 09:08 pm
I’m absolutely fascinated by this dog and impressed by his progeny!

Hemophilia - Blood Clotting Disorder
(a disorder linked to a recessive gene on the X-chromosome and occurring almost exclusively in males, in which the blood clots much more slowly than normally, resulting in extensive bleeding from even minor injuries)
Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 07:33 pm
IMO the best progeny groups at Karlsruhe 2004 were Nero & Yasko.
Posted: Tue Aug 31, 2004 01:59 am
It's not his mother who died, but his elder half brother. The mother is only the carrier of the damned gene :((
His progeny IS very nice looking.
Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2004 10:43 pm
"her mother dies of hemophylia... "

Weird. I thought females were only carriers and couldnt get sick. At least it's like that in humans...
Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2004 10:16 pm
His first Progeny-Group was very good!!! Gratulation to this Progeny!
Posted: Sun May 16, 2004 01:25 am
Ummmmm there are many bad news about Nero... her mother dies of hemophylia... one of his sister too ¡¡

Too much problems on the elbowns of his progeny

Some friends said what he is strictly forbidden by the SV.... who knows ¡¡¡

Somebody from Deutschland can tell us what is the true about Nero ???
Double B
Posted: Mon Apr 12, 2004 04:08 pm
When the article is true, Nero only can`t stud for a while because it is only injury.
Posted: Mon Apr 12, 2004 04:03 pm
i just read an artical here on this page, that Nero no longer can breed.
Posted: Sun Dec 14, 2003 03:28 pm
No idea.

During the discussions, it appeared that his conclusions was based on observations from his own breeding as well as litters from other bitches.

I do hope that the fault is not from Nero because I think he is a beautiful dog and I would love to have a puppy from him.

Olga Ashley
Olga Ashley
Posted: Sat Dec 06, 2003 11:28 pm
Eye color also depends on the bloodline of the bitch, what is the motherline of the litter?
Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2003 12:47 pm
Just learnt from a German breeder who has a litter from Nero commenting that some of his puppies have light coloured eyes. He suspected that it could be from Nero as Enzo has history of that too.

Anyone to confirm the suspicion?
Posted: Sun Nov 23, 2003 10:22 pm
His brown looked a lot darker today, then it is on the picture. He was properly brown.
Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2003 07:22 pm
Thank you for that extencive answer.
Of cours you are right in principle,if one mate to dogs with simmilar caracteristics(exteriar or mental)the likelyhood of the resulting puppies having many of these aswel is increased as to if one had bred two dogs that each show different caracteristics.
However I do still get an impression that you use the two words "genotype" and "phenotype" in a contence that is inaccurate.If it was written so that it meant something simmilar as the following I would have agreed;
If a male wich genotype stems from a sertain line of combinations of different induviduals genotypes is mated to a female wich genotype stems from a sertain line of combinations of different induviduals genotypes the puppies are more likely to have the phenotypic caracteristics that one strive for.If the two different lines have a common ansertory,wich would have resulted in the two parents havin many the same genes in their individual genotypes.
Breeding towards a goal has to do with enriching the koncentration of sairten and loss of other genes in the population.
This change occures only in the genotype,but the effects of it can be seen in the phenotype.
Naturaly this process is in no way different as regards to the exteriar caracteristics of the phenotype, for example eyecolor,and the mental caracteristics,such as anxheity.
However the way that mental caracteristics are inherrited is much more complicated than the exteriar caracteristics.
Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2003 03:36 pm
Hello Zoe, in reply to your question about Genotype and Phenotype, you are right to a degree in your assumptions, in the context on my writing it was on the Male Enzo v Buchhorn.I was stating that Enzo had produced this excellent Male "Nero" and the Type in my mind had come from the dam, and that a female given the right bloodline mated to Enzo he will produce.This you could call Genotype as in the case of Nero this mating is,on the Sire side 5 named Males in the 4th or 5th Generation doubled up on the Female side. I do not see any Phenotype coming from Enzo to Nero (do you??)an example if you are looking for Phenotype you mate a male and female together who resemble each other in type ,mate them and if you get a good result(Phenotype) , if this is also Genotype this is an added bonus.When I wrote before on the subject people with a vested interest wrote on behalf of Enzo, I did not say Enzo was a bad Male but only questioned his production in the UK, recently I noticed he is the UK`s top sire todate,it is the future I was more concerned with, I watch with interest.I also wish others who speak in public about certain dogs would sign up to the comments on this site, and not just the people with vested interest in certain dogs which always seems so one sided.
Posted: Tue Nov 18, 2003 10:15 pm
chad-Maby I¿m just tired and are therefor not paying good enough attention when reading right now but;
I reacted on your use of "genotype" and "phenotype".
It seemed that you were using them as a way to describe exteriar and interiar qualities of dogs.
I so I wfeel I must clearify what these words actually meen.(Normally I would wait until I was rested and read the message again,but I think that I would forget about about your comment by then.Just ignore the following if I have missread it.)
Genotype: The genetic make up of a organism.
Phenotype: The notisable and/or useful
properties posessed by the organism.This is controled and "made"by the geotype.
Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2003 05:02 pm
Hi Visum,
What is this Bengal Tiger screeeeming about. Give him a bottle to sleep with. This is no way to talk in open places. Yes Nero is a great Dog and proves beyond doubt the Lasso line. i would wait for a better progeny class from him but the sad thing in03 Sieger show is that a lot of VA dogs do not have a progeny class to talk about.
Posted: Thu Oct 09, 2003 11:25 am
Sorry,Double-B.This 'B" is really confusing me,'big' or 'double'.
Posted: Thu Oct 09, 2003 11:22 am
But,i feel, the type is different.This dog is a true representative of MARK HAUS BECK line and he is line bred on him. HOBBY's mother QUITTA is the daughter of mark vom haus-beck.Thanx Big-B
Double B
Posted: Sat Oct 04, 2003 04:28 pm
Look at his pedigree his mother is an Ursus daughter.
Posted: Sat Oct 04, 2003 01:49 pm
A very beautiful young dog with great pigments. He is also an alternative
to all the Ursus blood lines.
Posted: Wed Oct 01, 2003 08:12 am
Visum my email is
Posted: Tue Sep 30, 2003 01:41 pm
Well No man.........Im sorry I don't recall, what photograph was can write to me at my!
Posted: Tue Sep 30, 2003 11:09 am
Visum this is personally to you and I guess I met you in the Hyderabad show Indian seiger at the ground and I still remember that you were roaming in the ground with a photograph in your hand and I said to you that that dog in the photo seemed to be coming from the Odin strain, do you remember that.
Posted: Tue Sep 30, 2003 11:00 am
As odin I have no hard feelings for any dog as such but the matter which happened earlier was for a wrong information that was conveyed by one of my friend and I had to clear that out so that I could get the real story out. Anyway I have asked for an Appology for that from Stabb.
Big B
Posted: Mon Sep 29, 2003 10:26 am
Yeah well done ODIN 777.However I like the black pigment on the forehead of Nero and this should actually give him additional points if pigementation is taken into account.I once again say that he's a dream dog and will go up.
Posted: Mon Sep 29, 2003 09:28 am
Well Odin777..............this comment of yours is Fantastic and very informative, thankyou......don't you think this is So much bettre than attacking people......thankyou now I can see Nero in a different perspective...I hope we can get your views on more dogs like this....bye
Posted: Mon Sep 29, 2003 07:36 am
This dog has real good poetntial and really has a good future ahead. This dog has very good overline as well as underline and good volume. The forequarter angulation is good but the upper arm could be a little longer. The dog is off focused because of the blasckish pigmentation on the forehead region , I think this makes the dog a bit less projective than the other dogs that is the dogs expression is suppressed. As far as the anatomy is concerned it is just true to the type and the progeny I guess will be good. Good dog overall and has a higher placement in the near future.
Big B
Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2003 12:33 pm
Posted: Tue Sep 09, 2003 03:00 pm
Posted: Mon Sep 08, 2003 12:32 am
Absolutely exquisite dog, very deserving VA. I cannot wait to see his progeny, hopefully he will be a strong producer and carry on Mark's line.

Congratulations to Nero, his owners and breeders!!
Posted: Tue Jul 22, 2003 04:48 pm
Seen Nero at last years Sieger,He is a stunning male and a very convincing winner of the class.
Posted: Tue Jul 22, 2003 10:41 am
hi john,
i think you are waisting your time asking here about the dog, because most of the people in this so called discussion have seen the dog only on the pic.
the dog lives about half an hour from my house and i can give you my view of the dog:
very good - character & bitework, bone, color, head, coat, angulations, straight coming and going.
very, very good - expresion
very nice and friendly dog with a lot of positive to give us in the breed.
ognjen kapidzic
Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2003 07:01 pm
Dear Bengal Tiger, Thank you for your rather polite comment to me. Call me a meddler if you like, but when somebody starts acting in a way that compromises the integrity of the discussion and the site, then we have a responsibility to ask that person to stop. Your comments appeared to be a flaring personal attack in response to Visum's comment. I'm not the only one who found it distasteful, and you're not the only one who has been asked to tone down your language. Perhaps you and Visum, with whom you appear to have a personal conflict might email each other and hash it out between the two of you. It's not nice to call people pussies and the like. If this kind of online behavior doesn't stop, then Oli will ask a moderator to control the site. You don't want that, do you? We'll also lose some very sincere and knowledgeable contributors, like July and DMB, and then we won't have the benefit of their input.
Besides, this area is supposed to be about Nero Nöbachtal, isn't it?
bengal tiger
Posted: Sat Jul 19, 2003 04:07 am
dear kerry if somebody starts nasty comments then what do you expect me to do. in any case dont act like you have only one eye please don't meddle & if need be then be fair please just readgain to see from where nastiness started ok
Posted: Sat Jul 19, 2003 01:10 am
YES...This was supposed to be a discussion about Nero vom Nöbachtal.
I will ask again...has anyone here seen this dog and can you tell me about him?...I would like to hear some details about him other than he's gorgeous or he's magnificent...I would like to hear comments about him because I have only seen the picture of him...As a for instance, did he really stand out in his class at the BSZS?...Is he as good as the picture of him?..etc., etc.
Thank you.....
Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2003 08:43 pm
I can't belive it!!! This was supposed to be the comments page on Nero Nobachtal... What are you doing?
Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2003 05:26 pm
Bengal Tiger, please STOP making personal attacks on people, and STOP using such nasty language, or you will be invited to LEAVE this discussion site.
Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2003 12:57 pm
Mr. Bengal tiger, Visum did not say it has been his "EXPERIENCE" he said, "this happens in every country". To me this is a fair statement. There are a few top breeders today who started out as someone’s handler, this comment is irrelevant. Visum if someone does not agree with your comments that is no reason to take the discussion to a low level re: pu... hmmmm what was this discussion about again oh yeah Nero vom Nöbachtal nice dog.
bengal tiger
Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2003 11:45 am
Just examine things again i didnt made personal remarks at first, i only pointed to his very generalised remarks about dogs 'not on him personaly' which many people have already pointed on this site in the last many days. Misbehaviour started from him. Whatever i have stated is correct not a personal attack if you know him & if you call that misbehaviour then so be it.The one line at the end is a reply in his vein. And does showing an mailid entitles anyone to say anything blah blah blah i think rethink over it bye
Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2003 11:32 am
Tiger, sorry, you are the one "mishaveing" here. Please keep the thread free of personal attacks. Or send your personal remarks straight to Visum, he, unlike you, shows his email address.
bengal tiger
Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2003 10:32 am
Little boy it is only a few years since kala krishna has taught you how to walk ,you are nothing more than her handler What else is your credit,so don't try to run you will fall down. But now you are sitting in desais lap lo lo. You started the game by blaming people in every country & besides you pass a comment on any other dog like larus batu & pissed a lot of people. you make stupid comparisons like between ghandi arlet & uras bluerose. I have spend a lifetime in dogs in kolkata among gsd even a child can now know who i am, anyway i am not a pimp of a thief like desai nobody can purchase me by giving a free mating of a U dog my little baby grow up you have to go a long way so get out of the pussy be brave baby
Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2003 09:35 am
Bengal tiger......use this place tocomment on the dogs concerned not for personal attack. If you are so eager why don't you reaveal your true identy and then talk or atleast have the gutts to email me. you are nothing but a pussy....
bengal tiger
Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2003 04:59 am
Yes this happens in every country but how did you experience this as we have not had any VA rated dog in our country. Are you not part of that everybody. On this very site you were a height of sychophancy the other day comparing a dog that is not even a indian champion to a VA7 !!!! Ha Ha .
& even defending a dubious breeder and his dubious dog. Chi Chi
Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2003 01:27 pm
Well......This just happens in almost very country where people from one wing take pot shots at a Top Dog owned by somebody else! The important thing here is Enzo Buchorn Is A Top VA dog and a Dual American Seiger! He is the Father of Nero Nobachtal, How come you guys hold other males at very high regard for their progeney and attack a chosen few by saying its the mother line. So you mean to say Ursus has nothing to do with Yasko its only Connnie, and Yasko has nothing to do with Larus its just Jitta.....what Bul...t!!!
Its far simpler to accept a Good dog give him credit and Make use of the Oppurtunity you have been provided to use a TOP VA in your own Country!
Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2003 06:57 pm
It is so sad when people blame the poor quality in the rings in the UK today on one magnificent male - Enzo Buchhorn. He is not the only male at stud in the UK but from what I have seen of his progeny so far, he is probably the one who is producing the best. I used him on my Huppy von Arlett daughter and I am extremely pleased with the result. At only 5 months old, the female I kept is of correct size (how many sire's in the UK are of the correct size themselves never mind producing it in their offspring) has a fantastic colour (must have come from Enzo as Huppy lines are not strong in this direction, from my experience)very good bone and substance with firmness throughout. Temperament could not be better, absolutely 100%
And Nero Nobachtal? A dog to die for!!
Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2003 03:56 pm
Dear "Chad",
I suppose it was just a matter of time before someone within the UK, with a 'well masked' but very obvious hidden agenda attacked Enzo.

Enzo - A three times VA male and twice American Sieger who has produced over 600 korklasse 1A animals around the world, i.e. 600 GSD's with a minimum confirmation grading of Excellent, 'a' stamp hips and minimum working qualification of SchH1.

Please now show the courage of your convictions by identifying yourself, so that we can stop wasting other web-site user's time and make this PERSONAL.

Uday Jani
Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2003 03:29 pm
You folks have gone far afield.
Here is the original comment and question:

I think the attached picture of Nero vom Nöbachtal is gorgeous...Has anyone actually seen this dog in person?...Is he as gorgeous and as great as he looks in this picture of him?
I am interested in buying a female puppy or young female that is by him...Is there anyone who has one or can help me find one?
Thank you.
Please contact me at
Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2003 11:09 am
Would the people who seem concerned over the Nero / Enzo comments please understand this is not an attack on Enzo as a Male, only that if the proof of production can be measured by his prodgeny in the show ring then I am afraid that it would implie he is not a good producer here in the UK.In a year from now when all his prodgeny have had a chance to make their mark I will comment again and allow you to then say your veiws, to comment on him being one of the best imported males ever(yes I agree) but for production never, to be a producer you must be able to produce to all bloodlines,in the past we have had imports that within just 8mths + at stud have filled our rings with class animals, also to say that the show scene has been poor for the last 5 years,yes you are right and it will stay that way unless we can find males that can produce better than Enzo,the 2 top animals at the Sieger Show by Enzo to make it in 2002,were a result in finding the right females to allow Enzo to produce,this took nearly 4years, we do not have this time in the UK,if you look at my first letter you will understand this was the point I was trying to make in the first place, you must find the right females!!!(tell me is Enzo anything of the type of Nero) no way!!!!
Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2003 10:13 am
Nero is undoubtably a magnificent male, but it is wrong to attack his sire Enzo, the sire always gets the blame for a bad dog so surely should get some credit for a good one!! I too have used Enzo on my Champion female in the UK, she has had 4 litters and undoubtably this is her best litter to date. Whilst they are still only 6 months old, time will tell. Like Joyce I have seen many of the litters from Enzo in the UK and was so impressed I used him on my champion, I could have taken her back to Germany for mating but decided to use Enzo instead. Enzo's progeny in the UK are still very young and are just starting to make an impact, so come on give the dog a chance!!
Posted: Tue Jul 15, 2003 09:40 pm
I agree Nero is a fantastic male he is the product of two excellent parents, to say Enzo has had no impact is wrong. I have had the oppotunity to see most litters Enzo has produced in the UK and have seen some super puppies. One of his oldest progeny is currently Top puppy. His character is without fault and as 90% of puppies go to pet homes if Enzo gives his soundness of mind and body he will have done the breed in the UK a great service > there is no better foundation for a GSD.
Posted: Tue Jul 15, 2003 05:37 pm
Nero is a magnificent dog. Here in the UK we are very fortunate to have the opportunity to use his sire Enzo von Bucchorn.This dog is sound in both body and mind. Having used him I can honestly say that I believe he is one of the best imports we have had in the UK
and his temperament is second to none.From our Enzo litter we have the current Breed council top winning puppy dog who's litter brother is also a Best puppy dog Winner in the Uk and the litter sister who was exported to Pakistan was Best Puppy in Show at her 1st GSD Breed show.Enzo is certainly not to blame for the lack of good youngster
in our show ring today nor over the last 5yrs and things will only improve if we use the best dogs (to suit our bitches) available to us.
Posted: Fri Jul 11, 2003 05:22 am
Nero is a very nice dog, my concern is that for future breeding on the lines of this male is that you should follow his female line, his sire line has no impact on this dog. Enzo has now been in the UK for nearly 18mths at stud and apart from a short break produced nothing of any note,he has not impacted on the UK which can be seen in our rings, because of his use, and other males not being used our current classes of puppies and Juniors are weak.Enzo is an Excellent male himself but needs the strong inbred lines as in Germany to compliment his blood when mating, in the UK the females are more of a phenotype makeup.I would welcome others views on this as we must beware of this problem in the Uk, when you use an Import in England make sure if you are relying on the blood it comes from both parents,just look at the results in the Uk rings of the success of bloodlines some from VA males who have not set foot on our shores but have had much more success than Enzo, an example ,from an early age, Uran, Eiko,Mack, to English lines, its early days but remember all this when you praise a male for his ability to produce, it could set you back years.The main reason to mention this is that the current topic of show lines to working lines without the ability to produce both to phenotype and genotype would be a disaster to our beloved BREED.(PS ENZO gives very good working traits and temperament)and has the best Temperament I have seen in a GSD in all my years in the breed.
Posted: Fri Jul 11, 2003 12:21 am
Whoops, I thought that said 2002 not 2001 - my mistake!!
Posted: Fri Jul 11, 2003 12:20 am
Nero will not have bred yet, he is too young.
Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2003 04:03 pm
I think the attached picture of Nero vom Nöbachtal is gorgeous...Has anyone actually seen this dog in person?...Is he as gorgeous and as great as he looks in this picture of him?
I am interested in buying a female puppy or young female that is by him...Is there anyone who has one or can help me find one?
Thank you.
Please contact me at
Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2003 05:00 pm
Visum...Thanks for the information.
Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2003 06:44 am
This is the contact for owner of Nero.
Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2003 03:52 am
From what I can see in the picture of him, I think that Nero vom Nöbachtal is one of the best looking GSD I've seen.
I am trying to find the email address and/or the URL for the web site of Nöbachtal or the email address of Ingrid Moser, owner of Nero vom Nöbachtal.Can anyone please help?
Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2003 10:57 pm
man,i would love to have this dog.where is this dog now?how is he producing?and what is the price like?thanks
Posted: Sun Jun 15, 2003 05:08 am
Surely a Wonderful Dog....Iv only seen him on the SeigerShow CD's. We have a Lasso son in India too and he is produceing on par with Enzo Buchorn, ie Quarz vom Murrtal!
Nero to a Great boost to the Lasso line.
Great to get your views on most Top dogs here Mr.Solo thankyou....Thankyou Oli for this wonderful site
Posted: Sat Jun 14, 2003 09:18 pm
A magnificent male, of Ursus type, his mother being an Ursus daughter, a most powerful head, superb hair, colour and pigment. I am really looking forward to seeing his progeny. If he produces like himself,a Sieger for the future, surely. His contribution to the future of the breed could be immense.

This is a dog pedigree, used by breeders and breed enthusiasts to see the ancestry and line-breeding of that individual dog. The pedigree page also contains links to the dogs siblings and progeny (if any exist). For dog owners with purebred dogs this is an excellent resource to study their dog's lineage.


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