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That topic, GSDCA vs USCA has been discussed many times here, below is a link to old conversations on the subject. Hope it helps

https://www.pedigreedatabase.com/german_shepherd_dog/community.search?f=&s=+GSDCA+vs+USCA

Hello all,

I am very new to the world of SV and I'm trying to figure some things out. I would love to trial for a BH and an AD on my dog, but I'm not sure which parent club to go with. There are more trials in my area through USCA, but I also heard that USCA accepts GSDCA scorebooks. I'm currently a member of both (without a scorebook), but USCA is very expensive and I'm wondering if it's worth it to remain a member.

My puppy is currently 5 months old, so we have a lot of time ahead of us. Is the WB required if I want to compete for an AD or BH? If so, how can I find those events? I'm still so confused on everything SV and I don't even know how to register my dog with SV. I would like to show him in SV as well, but I believe I can only get a show rating and not a breed rating because he's a longcoats born from two stock coats and his sire came from a stock x long breeding.

I would just love some insight on all of these things, but especially the topic of GSDCA vs USCA. I will also mention that I plan on competing in PSA instead of IGP, but I still want to get a BH on him.

Thanks in advance!

So both clubs are recognizing titles?  A SCH I earned at a GSDCA event entered in a GSDCA scorebook is recognized by UScA in order to obtain a SCH II at a UScA event?  Also is this scorebook able to be used internationally (GSDCA)? Would a GSDCA scorebook have to be "certified" by UScA (where you have to mail in it to get their stamp)?  Also can one use this scorebook to goto...let's say the AWDF or a DVG trial as well?   

Sitasmom- Why the LG 16?  Who is your point of contact?  And then do you have to be aware of what club affiliation the Judge is that you trial at (SV vs. USca vs. GSDCA etc.)? 

It is much easier to train the dog then to figure all of this out.....go figure. 

Dog1,
I agree! Stupidity never ceases to amaze me!
I can tell you the most important thing that the JA accomplished.
It made people in both organizations start to think about what is really important to the future of this breed and which organizations do and don't promote what the GSD is supposed to be.
It really isn't about UScA vs. WDA.
It is about the choice between UScA and what it promotes for the GSD vs. GSDCA and what it promotes for the GSD.
The other thing to note here is that you seem to be more interested in making this in to a discussion about the JA.
Personally, I really don't care whether that rule stays or goes, but, I do support the UScA and their right to have that rule as it was voted on and approved twice at consecutive GBM's.
Time will tell how this plays out.
-------------------------------------------------

As for the FCI, AKC and the GSDCA don't be so sure.
As soon as the WDA is gone, so is the GSDCA from the WUSV.
In the German Shepherd world that is really all that matters.
Also, the WUSV pulls a lot of weight with the FCI, especially the FCI Working Dog Commission.
Why the GSDCA wants to be involved with WUSV makes zero sense to me.
The GSDCA should stick to what they do and leave the rest of the GSD world to itself.
As for the FCI, think about what happened with RSV2000.
They were granted provisional status with the VDH in 2009 which made them a part of the FCI.
The FCI is willing to allow more than one national breed club.
The AKC even accepts RSV2000 registration papers now. They have to.
Again concerning the FCI, there has been a lot of groundwork laid by the AWDF with the FCI Working Commission.
You may have noticed that the AWDF sends the team from the U.S. to the FCI-IPO Chmpionship, not the AKC.
If you think this is a battle that can't be won think again.

Every other AWDF member club has to pay to have their score books stamped/certified ($40? fee ) by UScA in order to trial at a UScA trial.
According the the SV letter do GSDCA/WDA score books need to be stamped also or not?
$40 to join WDA vs X$ to join another breed club + $40 to have their AWDF score  book stamped?????
Personnaly I'd like to see UScA leave the WUSV/SV to the American and German Show GSD people and join RSV2000.
Poll the UScA membership and go to one member one vote


Thomas Barriano
Dubheasa Germania (11/05/99-08/11/08) SchH III M R Brevet AKC WD III AWD 1 STP 1 CD WAC TT
Ascomannis Jago (06/20/03) SchH III AKC WD III AWD I TT WAC
Belatucadrus (08/14/05) DS BH TT MR I
Flannchadh von der Bavarianburg (5/21/08) TT IPO II STP I
Winterfell Arya (11/27/09)BH TT K9NW I
Gwrgenau vom Himmelhoch (8/19/09) BH TT

Just wondering why this has to be a UScA vs WDA thing?
Wallace started this thread and he did so because he cares about the integrity of the sport.
It was BooBoo that decided to try to make this about UScA vs WDA.
Why not just discuss whether it is proper for the GSDCA-WDA to send teams to the qualifier that didn't actually qualify?
If you believe they are entitled to compete at the qualifier, say so and why.
Leave the rest of the crap out of it.

 

There is no such thing as a WUSV judge. SV judge, and SV foreign judge. WUSV is the World union of Gewrman shepherd organization in the world. Each country has a German Shepherd organization. To have an SV foreign judge per country is a good idea. The most important issue is a breed registry. I understand that the SV sieger show is the Mecca of our breed. But each country to be able to keep up with the higher SV standard is to have a breed registry similar to the SV. Ideally each country should be an Ortsgruppe of the SV, or considered a region, but the almighty FCI will not allow such. Herr Messler hypothetically ask each WUSV member nation in 2002 if separating from FCI would be feasible but none of the WUSV nations would want to do it. For you to conclude that having an SV foreign judge in every country will improve the breed registry of their respective country and outcomes of dogs, is hands down fallible. There are 2 organizations in USA, the GSDCA has an SV foreign judge vs none in USCA. Do you feel that the GSDCA is far superior in implementing the basic tenets and requirements of the SV in paper and in practice? NOT! The politics and business side of this hobby is not doing the breed a favor. I wish WUSV would just drop from the FCI, and each country, obliged to adhere with the SV breed registry requirements. That means, a drop in business, for a lot of backyard and commercial breeders. I agree with Solo, maybe our own local judges program should be developed and promoted with SV's cooperation. Sherman, you put more emphasis on a small show in Germany, than a USA Sieger? If my dog was judged by Johaness and passes her Sch, you feel your dog may be superior, as she was passed by an SV judge? Did ou know Johaness was also an SV judge till he left Germany in 1981? You want international recognition using an SV? I person in the know, do not automatically take a dogs title based on SV title. How many dogs you've seen that are V1 in a small show in Germany, beaten by a local dog in a big show here, judge also by an SV judge or Johaness. Some dogs judged by Johaness, did very well internationally. JMHO, ROger Roger.

Past personal disagreements notwithstanding, the basics of Wallace's assertions have merit.  The WDA and USCA have much more in common than either organization has with the GSDCA.  Much has been written about the GSDCA "standard" vs the FCI "standard".  But those differing breed standards are not nearly as significant as the full WUSV member club obligations stated in the WUSV Constitution:

- Recognize the racial features of the GSD as stipulated by the SV.
- Recognize the Breeding Book for GSD's and the Book of Selection for Breeding Purposes of the SV as the mother country of the breed...
- Control of breeding, raising, owning and training on the basis of SV regulations.
- Setting up and carrying out activities for breeding purposes in accordance with the SV's "Regulation for the Selection fro Breeding Purposes".
- Holding of Breeding events based on SV regulations.
- Holding of own and support of SV training activities including herding.
- Training and admission of expert Judges and Breed Survey Masters in accordance with SV and WUSV Judge regulations.
- Settting up and carrying out tattoo and microchip programs.
- Effecting the WUSV world championship in accordance with SV Trial Regulations, which must be carried out each year by another member association.

Both WDA & USCA subscribe to the same basic creed.  That is, the basic SV/WUSV model.  GSDCA (and peace to my many friends therein) simply marches to a different drummer.  

Why would the WUSV care?  Membership numbers and $$$ (again, IMHO).  Website info has changed since my last research and I was not able to find current data.  In 2011 the WUSV website reported 6,000 GSDCA members--at the same time that the official GSDCA membership list published about 3,000 members +/-.  Perhaps creative membership accounting?  As of 3/23/2011 the WDA enjoyed 1,284 members.  Word has it that WDA membership has fallen since that time.  USCA membership is now documented at about 3,500 members (March/April 2013 magazine), with a stated goal of 5% growth over the next four years.

So, Sir/Madame Bubbabooboo, would you like to re-evaluate which American GDS organization is "tiny" with "less than 3,000 members"?  

But to return to the original challenge, why should WDA and USCA not join forces?   As usual, the devil is in the details.  For me personally, the question is whether or not the USCA embraces the full spectrum of GSDs that fulfill SV/WUSV criteria?  From deep personal experience, all too often USCA clubs/members are openly hostile to showline dogs and their owners, regardless of the demonstrated working ability of the dogs.  (The knee jerk reaction that any GSD from genetic "showlines" automatically embodies "Schutzhund Light" is particularly offensive.)  The GSD breed is simply not ALL about the world team.  Rather, it is about the extreme versatility of the breed.  

Why have I chosen to support USCA over WDA?  Despite my misgivings about the USCA as a breed organization, I know and trust Jim Alloway.  He was our past club training director/helper and knows first hand the working quality of my (VA) show dogs.  I trust Jim's honesty, deep experience and comittment to the breed.  Contrast that with Dan Yee, who, by any definition, is a newbie to the breed and sport.  

Here's hoping that USCA and WDA will merge--but with experienced "boots on the ground" leaders rather than political gladhanders...

Gayle

just 4 weeks ago, the president of GSDCA/WDA tried to have the representative of UScA removed from the WUSV meeting...unsuccessfully, I might add....why would UScA want any of its' members blonging to an organization that wants its' demise....this is not the first time this has been attempted....sounds like SV vs RSV2000

We are having the WUSV in America this year.....oh boy

@momosgarage

It really boils down to consumer choice and convenience

I completely agree, and currently it seems that consumers are choosing to be a part in all the clubs available. People may initially join an organization for numerous reasons but they either stay because they like that organization or they jump to another. Heck a bunch jumped from the UScA ship a while back and then returned, even before the whole Yee vs the GSDCA lawsuit. I like having choices so please stop advocating that my choice be taken away for your convenience.

i cant stand it any more.

someone said this is not about show vs. work.    are you kidding me?  that is the heart of the matter.  dogs overbreed for looks and lacking in working ability.  dogs overbreed for working with the correct conformation to allow them to work all day.

i believe gustav had the best scene when he described what has happened here in the USA with USCA and the GSDCA. 
why did the gsdca change its way?  because there was no way in hell they could make a world team with the dogs that did great in the show ring, but couldnt work a lick.  lets not forget the gsdca connection to AKC. 

did everyone miss mystere's statement.      What is being discussed here is the "dethroned" SV Nationall Breed Warden, who could not get the SV to move in a direction more valuing of health/nerve/working ability over cosmetics and money,

oh well, another subject lost on narrowmindedness, onesidedness, and complete lack of understanding what a ulitarian dog is. 

john

Well said, Openmind.  I join you in urging WDA members to vote NO to all three proposals.  

The membership voted in 2010 to make the Secretary position an elected one.  200 members voted in support of the amendment and only 23 members voted against it.  What has changed, less than 2 years later?  The GSDCA elects their Secretary, with no apparent issues.  I'm not sure about how the UScA handles its electied vs. appointed positions.  Does anyone know the SV governing practices?  Are all officer positions elected, or are some appointed?

The proposed quorum change, if passed, will destroy the member's rights to check and balance the board.  The board exists to serve the membership.  Did anyone on the Board solicit member input before drafting such kingdom building amendments?  Did the regional directors communicate with their constituents? 

WDA members, please vote NO to the proposed bylaw changes.

Gayle

I am mostly familiar with UScA, what do the other organizations offer the helpers in terms of training opportunity? Does the DVG and GSDCA have the same requirements for the different helper level classifications? I know that within the UScA there is the Helper College and mentorship, do the other orgs offer this? I am really asking cuz I just dont know? But I really dont understand the need for or reasoning behind the different factions either. Do they all three share similar mission statements as to their purpose? Is it just a matter of All breed vs Breed specific?

I like your questions. They speak to the buyer of a companion dog. Buyers of competition dogs are, for the most part, in the loop already and need neither an Internet database nor a breeder's Website on which to base their decisions. Buyers of companion dogs, those refered to as "just pets", do rely on the sources you mention.

When we researched breeders for our new puppy we knew two things: the lines we didn't want and the lines we did want. We checked the database for our desired lines and then meandered through the Internet looking at their progeny. We eventually found a breeder who concentrated on our preferred lines. We checked the claims on her Website against information available on the Internet. For instance, if it says XYZ went VA at such-and-such a show, that's pretty easy to verify.

All breeders'  Websites say pretty much the same, had you noticed? We belong to USCA, GSDCA, SV. We breed to the standard (which standard??). We OFA. We CERF. All our dogs are raised in the house. Yadda yadda yadda. We weren't necessarily looking for a name brand kennel but on the other hand, we weren't looking for a one-litter-every-three-years breeder, either.

We searched the USCA site on breeder's last name to see how much/often/why he/she showed the dogs. Trained enough to meet the minumum requirements for a breed survey was a plus, more so, in fact, than a breeder who cranks out Vs each year (but not many SchH3s or FH3s) - because we weren't looking for a working (or competition) dog.

Communications with the breeder were critical. Could they give us names of past buyers? Did they know whether their 7 or 8 year old progeny had ever suffered bloat? Allergies? EPI? Are they still in touch with their old puppy buyers?

A known reputation is a good thing if it's a good reputation but the only way you know that is by reading a variety of forums and talking to people. And going to shows and trials.

As it turned out our research using PDB and the Internet in general led us to an excellent breeder. How did people find their new puppies in the olden days, before this resource was available?????

 

I find it interesting that there is no discussion above about actively selecting dogs for longevity - it works. I was concerned about longevity in our breed back in the 70's and added longevity in the pedigree as a very important factor in looking at dogs. Result - dogs that live healthy lives until 13 or 14. Even in the Amreican lines - they realized they have a tremondous problem with longevity so the GSDCA started a "thirteen club" ( which USCA certainly could do also) that recognizes a dog which reaches it's 13th year( actually passes it's 12th birthday is their criteria). And as I said selecting for it does work. There was a discussion awhile back on this board up breeding to young dogs as the "smart" thing to do - 'cause after they were 3 or so the breeders in the "know" had moved on to the next best thing. Heck give me an 11 year old who's still breeding (been there) any day. A. Testament to health and longevity and b. Probably have a good idea what true quality he produces. Check out Becky Rodgers site - Valkyre GSDs - she's doing something right she's had several dogs who have lived to 15+. Molly, I believe there is mounting evidence that there is some genetic link or at east a genetic predisposition to hemangio. It also seems to be on a time clock. Have known of littermates that all died of it within several months of each other. At a minimum I think its one of those things that would behoove us to start to track until we can develop more information about it. Interestingly my very first shepherd suffered a spleenic bleed they suspected was caused by hemangio and survived w/o any extraordinary measures. Lived several more years until mast cell tumours caused her to be put down. The 3 big illnesses I've seen in older GSDs are DM(late onset slow progression vs the young dog DM wh/ is early and fast), mast cell tumours and cardio myopathy(enlarged heart). The last in some ways is the easiest and toughest at the same time. Easiest because they seem to live great active lives until one day they and their heart just get too old and tired. Hardest because once it is determined it's a very very short time they have. It's always tough regardless the cause but with the DM often when the body gives out the mind and spirit are still as bright as ever wh/ isn't always true of old dogs that get sick from other things so sometimes it's hard finding the right time to say goodbye.

As the trophy sponsor for the "American Bred" Working Male class - it is disappointing to see dogs that are BRED in Germany get awarded this honor. 

 

How very sad to see someone with $$$$$$$$$ get a trophy for being able to be in a financial position to spend more $$$$$$$$ to send their dogs to Germany to be bred.  I think the GSDCA has a description of what American Bred is .... not the F-1 or 2 .... but dogs that are BRED in America.

 

My V-6 dog was BRED in America.  He is second generation of my breeding program.  His father, while yes he was imported from Germany, lives here and was available for breeding to anyone in the US.

 

We all know how difficult it is to achieve quality breedings in the US vs in Germany.  There is no comparison (unfortunately) in the numbers of great dogs - thus the reason for awarding the breeder for successful breedings IN AMERICA..

 

I have asked Danny S. (WDA) to look into the verbage for this award.  I would like to see USCA come up with something as well.  Maybe if we had a highest German Bred trophy & highest American Bred trophy we would see the problem?!?

 

We need to award this trophy for the right reasons ..... the difficulty to achieve successful breedings here in the US.

I have lost my rose collared glasses regarding the SV but I still believe it is WAY better than the GSDCA. I use to believe that a dog titled in Germany was something special until i was at a club in CA and a "friend of the club" brought out a newly imported Showline (I am not making this a working vs Showline point) and they wanted to do some bite work. The dog has an IPOIII title but did not know what to do with the sleeve. The reason given by the friend of the club was "its a new dog and we have not worked together much". I just busted out laughing as i really thought he was joking. Heck i will hand my line to anyone to hold and my dog will re-act to "pressure" from a helper regardless of sleeve showing. I have heard tons of stories about these German titles or the midnight trials that occur with judges being brought over just to sign score books and have a vacation. But i am still hopeful that this is changing in the US. I know a few SV Judges that really believe in the preservation of the GSD and really have a passion about the dog. I know of clubs here that have been busted for midnight trialing by UScA judges and the UScA forcing investigations to nullify titles. I know that the SV has stripped some judges and reversed titles in Germany.

I am still nieve enough to believe that we can make a change for the better but it requires people standing up and calling BS when BS is in their face regardless of the whiplash of hate. I have no hope for GSDCA :(

Kim Your FIRST sentence in this thread:

"With the reason that one of the main reasons for USA to become exclusionary in their membership is that GSDCA and WDA do not have FCI breed standards, I actually went and read them for myself. There really are no differences."

The differences have been pointed out to you, by no less than an entire article written by Fred Lanting.  You want to discount or disregard what he says, that's certainly your perogative, and if you want to change the subject of the thread that is certainly your perogative.  What you have NOT done is proven the thesis of your essay in your original post.  In fact, the standards ARE different, the judging IS different and the breeders ARE different. 

Louise:   I am not going to get into a show vs working thing with you.  Suffice it to say the following statement you made regarding dogs varying considerably from the FCI standard is incorrect. 

"JMHO--USA is about breeding and owning "sport dogs" (most of which are imported as competition dogs)--which may vary considerably from the FCI standard. Many of the dogs representing USA on the World Team are not of breeding quality and do not conform to the breed standard (read: dog agression, handler agression, cryptorchids, structural faults, etc.)."

Really Louise?  One of the dogs on the UScA team is a KKL1.  Please tell me which of the 2 other dogs you know for a fact  has any strutural faults that would preclude him/her from obtaining at least a KKL2 to say nothing of a KKL1?

Curses - I had almost finished f0rmatting this then the computer switched to a different address without saving where I was up to....

 

[Reliya] 4.6.2016 - 16:06
After the WDA's first response to my query vanished before I could find & open it, I tried again. Your information is correct, and the GSDCAmerica and the WDA are busy suing each other. GREAT way to promote our superb breed! Time will tell what the outcome will be, but I doubt that it is likely to be one where the GSDCAmerica decides to pass FCI#166 to the AKC as THE Standard to use for GSDs. Which may drive the WDA people to abandon the GSDCAmerica and transfer completely to the USCA. Don't Yanks LOVE suing one another!

[susie] 7.6.2016 - 19:06

● "Les, I thought about "coloring" my post like you do, but, honestly, I am too lazy..."
Honesty is said to be a virtue. I've never heard claims that laziness is a virtue.
I use whatever techniques are available to me in order to COMMUNICATE. Colours and sizes worked well with most pre-teen children. (Does ANYTHING work with teenagers???)
If you and your contacts can communicate with plain-text, that's fine.
Stingy YahooAnswers with the incompetent programmers that Marissa Mayer has been employing for about 4 years is the only place where I WILLINGLY use plain-text. I LOATHE web-forms !

● "All of them made their own experiences or observations within AKC, GSDCA, USC(!)A, SV, perfectly fine."
THERE - those last 2 words - we part company.
The AKC and the GSDCAmerica (please always state WHICH "GSDCA" you refer to - the GSDCAustralia is very progressive and has successfully combined with Australia's Rottweiler clubs to convince the ANKC that breeds won't thrive unless there are RESTRICTIONS as to which pooches can have litters registered. The GSDCAmerica either has not attempted it or has dismally failed) do NOT promote the GSD as it is "seen" by members of USCA and the WDA. They don't even have the same written Standard. The WDA's standard is the current FCI#166. I haven't looked at the USCA Standard for a few years - last time I'm pretty sure they had the 1991 WUSV Standard.
As any boat builder or house builder will tell you, if the blueprints are different, so will be what's built based on those blueprints.

● "Why do you start to nitpick on any word said, pointing out any single poster? It´s useless, and it´s rude."
#1: Obviously you'd be surprised at what a small percentage of the errors *I* notice get a corrective comment. Noticing errors is what competent teachers learn to do.
#2: Teaching points are "useless" to only those who decide to take no notice of what I point out.
#3: I cannot prevent people from considering it rude when it affects them personally - but I trained as an educator, not as a politician, and as any educator will inform you, educators quickly become used to casting their pearls before real swine.

● "You are the one who referred to FCI standard 166, nobody else besides me ( because I am German...)"
You overlook the point that when a bare "the Standard" or "our Standard" is stated (as WAS done in this thread), what the people who believe in the wisdom of The KC(UK) think of is different to what those who believe in the wisdom of the AKC think of, which is different to what those who believe in the wisdom of the NZKC think of, which is different to what those who believe in the wisdom of the WUSV think of. And so what each of those groups of "believers" actually "build" and regard as a GSD is different to what the others "build" and regard as a GSD. The purpose in developing the EUSV and then Dr Rummell extending it to be the WUSV (he invited my local GSD club to join it in June 1973, before the EUSV agreed on 9 September 1974 to the extension) can be seen as either an attempt to have the SV "Rule the world of GSDs", or as a way to have everything that is registered as a GSD BE worthy of the breed's name instead of there being AlsatiOns, Banana-Backs, German Crouchers, Hyaena Dogs, NAmerican Ski-Slope Dogs, "Panda"-Shepherds, Teeth-on-Feet, Titanic Tail-Tuckers, White Shepherds, and Just-Plain-Craps ALL registered as GSDs

● "I am only speaking for myself now, the OFFICIAL translation for "Deutscher Schäferhund" is "German Shepherd dog", NOT "German Shepherd". You don´t like it? Tell the SV..."
You are simply wrong.
The current English version of FCI#166 was translated by the SV. It obeys English rules for punctuating proper nouns. Deutsche has different punctuation rules. Deutsche also combines the words "schäfer" and "hund" to give the single word "Schäferhund", whereas English separates the 2-words of "Deutscher Schäferhund" into the 3 words of "German Shepherd Dog".
But for you to SEE that you must not go to
http://www.fci.be/Nomenclature/Standards/166g01-de.pdf
- you must go to
http://www.fci.be/Nomenclature/Standards/166g01-en.pdf
and read through the first 3 pages to see that NOT ONCE is "German Shepherd dog" printed. Instead you will see:
GERMAN SHEPHERD DOG (Deutscher Schäferhund)
TRANSLATION: Verein für Deutsche Schäferhunde (SV) E.V. / Original version: (D).
Society for the German Shepherd Dog
German Shepherd Dog
World Union of German Shepherd Dog Clubs (WUSV)
German Shepherd Dog
German Shepherd Dog

● ""Stock coat" and "long stock coat" are VERSIONS of coat lengths, but it´s ONE breed according to SV and FCI standard. German SV is not responsible for any "standards" written outside of FCI"
Of course it isn't.
But it IS responsible for wordings it presents to the WUSV for approval. It IS responsible for the way it maintains it breed register. It IS responsible for the way it organises its conformation classes.

So why does it have one set of age-classes for SHs aka "Double Coats", and a separate set of age-classes for LSHs aka "Long and Harsh Outer Coats"?

Are "pink" pedigrees available for pups who have one SH parent, one LSH parent? If they are, is there any indication that the intention is to allow that "forever", or that there is an intention to ban such cross-breedings after a few years? I've written to ask my SV contact about these things, but she is a busy woman and could takes ages to reply. So I'm "boxing on" without her reply.

● "and within SV any long coat without under coat, blue, liver, or white German Shepherd dog, as long as bred out of pedigreed, titled, and breed surveyed parents, will remain a German Shepherd dog within SV and FCI, NOT allowed for breeding, but still a German Shepherd dog."

I've long been under the impression that, as of the 5 Sept., 1930 conference of Executive Committee and Board at Wiesbaden, self-whites weren't registerable except as Alt Deutschers.
Your claim certainly makes it easy to understand why so many producers of blue, liver, self-tan or self-white remain as Spitzen-Vs and VAs. Even Gregor Mendel could have told the SV that it won't get rid of the b^, d^, e^ alleles while it allows carriers to mate other carriers. As those 3 alleles are now DNA-identified, the SV SHOULD be allowing carriers to mate non-carriers for maybe a decade, after which carriers are verboten.

● "Titles - qualifications? I am German, so I am not sure, but all my American friends say "titling/title", and at school I learned that I may "qualify" FOR something - in "my world" ( and in the world of all sport enthusiasts I ever met ) they don´t try to qualify for something, they want to title their dogs...might be wrong.
You are not wrong about what DogSport addicts "want" and what Americans SAY - it is well-known that Yanks (whether damn' Yankees or Johnny Rebs at heart) ignore English. "The Scotch and the Irish leave you close to tears. There even are places where English completely disappears. Well, in America, they haven't used it for years!" as per https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAYUuspQ6BY
But the FACT is that titles are what go in front of names, and qualifications are firstly EARNED and then go AFTER the names, as with
President  Barack Hussein Obama  B.A., J.D.
Sieger 2011-12 VA1  Remo vom Fichtenschlag  SchH3,  Kkl.1
Field Marshall Prince  Charles Windsor  B.A.
Chancellor  Angela Dorothea Merkel  B.Sc., Ph.D. (I'm not going to track down the Deutsche initials for her degrees, so have used the English ones.)

● ""OP" = "individual poster" = someone who starts a thread = common parlance."
The would be "EP" in Deutsche, "IP" in English - not "OP".
But who wants to be "common"?
As for "OP" - I gather you'll be surprised by the main meanings:
http://www.acronymfinder.com/OP.html
In my wife's case, "OP" was "Other People's" while she was pretending to give up smoking, by smoking only "Other People's" cigarettes - lots more people smoked 30 years ago and she never actually quit smoking.
But the weakness of using the "OP" abbreviation is that it is so indefinite. The person's actual name or ID is much more helpful to enable us to check back and see what context statements were originally in.

As for the OP - she was delighted by my semi-critique of her bitch, which - not being a NAmerican Ski-Slope Dog judge - I critiqued as a GSD, much as I believe the late Dr Walter Gorrieri (Italy) would have (his drawing showing the outline & skeleton of a GSD that exactly fits the Standard was widely used in Australia and NZ before the influence of Hermann Martin saw the German Croucher take over). I am now waiting for her to find where she hid her computer so that she can find out what members of one of my e-groups thinks of her bitch. Perhaps she is as worried about her end-of-June show as I am worried about getting a Warrant of Fitness for my manual ute (that I was last able to drive on 24 April 2015, before "they" started cutting bits off my clutch leg and left me unable to step out of my house - I had to be carried in & out by a pair of ambulance men each time for the first 6 or so months) so that I can get my local garage owner to drive it & me to look at the automatic utes I now need one of and do a trade-in deal. The rush is because Bea's breeder has to be only about 90 minutes away from me on Thursday 30 June instead of her normal 4¼ hours away, and has offered to return Bea (who also hasn't seen me since 24.4.2015). Which means I need to be able to DRIVE to the butcher's for dog meats, and DRIVE Bea to a couple of places where it is flat (I have a VERY steep drive and have hobbled up & down it only 1½ times since getting my prosthetic, and it is PERFECT for her to pull me off my feet if she sees one of the many stray cats that hunt in this area). Which means that I need to have a fully licensed & registered old ute by the 24th so that my garage chap can drive me on the 25th to choose my next transport.

The first drawing in
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/The_GSD_Source/photos/albums/161016253
is a coloured version of Dr. Gorrieri's illustration (that group is NOT a discussion group).

Half-way down
http://www.louisdonald.com/archives-1986-the-great-debate---a-question-of-type.html
is a Dr Gorrieri "sable" drawing without the skeleton showing.

Those who have time to work through the 41-page article by Louis Donald (effectively a protege of Dr Gorrieri) should be prepared to grit their teeth about the photos of "top GSDs" standing with their rear knee lower than that leg's heel, placed amid a series of Gorrieri-based drawings with their knees correctly higher than their heels and their forward heel well clear oif the ground:
http://www.gsdcouncilaustralia.org/gsdcacontent/uploads/2015/03/louis_donald_article1-reduced.pdf

● ""USA" / "USCA" : Sorry for that - in "former times" the term "Schutzhund USA" was common, and that´s what I remembered - my fault..."
More the fault of the many USCA members who still tweely write "USA" instead of "USCA". If they want to be "USA" they need an AGM to re-name the organisation.

● "Your "quote" from me: "I don´t know anything about "AKC" shows, but I guess a "medium" angulated dog won´t have much chances in their shows"...
You don´t need to "ditto" that, and start to tell me about SV shows, because on page ONE I already said:
 " It´s not mainly about the color, but about the structure. Most sables are "European working lines", their structure doesn´t fit to the AKC standard - that said, they will have problems ( and structure wise a lot of working lines do have problems in my country, too )."
I don't CARE whether they fit the AKC pretend-"Standard". I care whether they fit the INTERNATIONAL Standard. I don't remember anything in the GSDCAm/AKC rebel "Standard" that would disqualify a genuine GSD. But there is plenty in FCI#166 to disqualify pooches that AKC judges happily promote. The problem isn't FCI#166 - it's the way so many many MANY NAmerican breeders and judges seek exaggerations.

● ""Javir Talka Marda" ? What are you dreaming about? Training, titling, showing German Shepherd dogs is done because it´s fun for more than 100 years now, a "G" rated dog, be it on a local show or at a local club trial, is "breedworthy" = "fitting to the standard", as soon as health tests, and breed survey are done. Don´t tell me that you belong to all of these "outlanders" ( sorry ) who only believe in "winners" - that´s way too easy."
Is it dreaming to believe that a pooch that gains high points (V) at both the BSZS event and the PreisHüteSieger event is superior to a pooch that can perform well at only one of them?
Living in a country where, until relatively recently, sheep (meat and wool) were our most important export, I am aware that there are few farmers nowadays willing to loan their flocks for use in a PHS contest. but even so, the Universal Sieger title that Javir (and 3 of my "Queen Miriam''s GSDs) earned from a conformation contest followed by a training contest is better than either of the 2 contests' separate siegers. I haven't seem a lot of Javir progeny & grandprogeny in the "news" - but that happens to some BSZS Siegers and some IPO/SchH Siegers, too.

As for the IPO/SchH training - you are welcome to find it "fun", but you need only look at Australia, Britain, Canada, New Zealand, the USA and work out the percentage of GSD owners (and BSD, Rottweiler, etc owners) who qualify their stock in IPO/SchH compared to the percentage who DON'T, to realise that the relatively high percentage of GSDs that compete in DogSport where you are is due to #1 a little bit of pride in being able to get a dog to operate as a partner and #2 a LOT of compulsion if the owner wants to breed from the GSD or campaign it to gain V at LGSchauen and aim for VA at the BSZS.

● "I think it´s nice you came over here, we do need experienced people ( did you breed your dogs according to SV standard/titles or according to NZ standard ? ), but it´s not nice to behave like a "I know it all", there are enough people of this kind already."
From 1968 to about mid-1972 we bred by what won in NZKC rings - a mixture of AlsatiOn and Prick-Eared Basset. And then the breeders of our High Clear bitches (who owned the first dog AND first bitch to be awarded an SV Gold Medal - that was under Herr Philip Hutter in 1967) showed me photos of Heiko Oranien Nassau
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/GSDAC_Committee/info?yguid=70025627
The difference drove me to the GSD books I had bought, and the eventual decision was that "AlsatiOn/Prick-Eared Basset is WRONG, Deutsche Schäferhund is right". And as of February 1976 we abandoned the all-breeds ring - although Bea & I were there the day her sister completed her CH. title just 2 miles from my home (Jo-Jo is still waiting for the 1-more all-breeds Best In Show win needed to join her sire as a Grand Ch.).

● "I tried to answer some of the OPs questions via PM, because within this thread it became useless. Hopefully some AKC enthusiasts will help, too. Everybody who is interested in "our" breed deserves as much help as possible, no matter the country, no matter the club."
It depends on whether the help is to #1 help them realise what their pooch's flaws and virtues are, or to #2 "help" them accept that kennel club show-judges are the "true prophets" as to what a GSD should be. I'm against #2, preferring to  educate that although preferences for aspects that remain WITHIN the International Standard are okay, preferences for exaggerations or other aspects that lie OUTSIDE the International Standard are NOT okay.