Code of Silence??? - Page 1

Is there an unwritten code of silence with those of us who breed???

If a breeder has a litter with a puppy that has a congenital deformity that they have never seen before within their lines and knows for sure that atleast one other breeder using the very same stud dog has produced the same defect should this be discussed with others who have used the same dog? By this I mean asking if they had any problems with their litter from said stud.

It just seems to me that no one is willing to talk, I am by no means wanting to run down any other dogs as I know that it takes * Two to Tango * and I am quite willing to talk about any problems produced by my bitches.

Not all congenital deformities would prevent some breeders from using a dog but some can impact on the quality of life of the puppy involved.

If breeders don't talk to each other then just HOW are we to help this Fantastic breed and not produce problems that can possibly haunt us for many years to come.


Just thought that I could start up a discussion on the subject because I for one would like to know what I could expect from a litter.

By congenital deformities, do you mean things like megaesophagus?

I would answer, but Chuck Norris said if he wanted my opinion, he would beat it out of me. HAHA

Yes by congenital deformities I am talking about PRAA, Megaeophus, tail deformities that impact greatly on a puppy by affecting the spine ( I have one of these ATM ) but the list is long and I know that many deformities are not known imediately, that is until the puppy is established in it's new home and the breeder receives a phone call stating that there is a problem and they are the saddest ones.

Good luck !

So NO COMMENT

DOES NO ONE REALLY CARE

Dogshome 9.Idont think its because ppl.dont care,most probably because ppl.are afraid of the repercussions from said stud dog owner/breeder.I,m a show person from England n here we have 2 ladies who have been in the breed for a long time,both have shown/bred GSDS n now spend a lot of their time researching n collating data of gsds that have congenital diseases .Unfortunately they CANNOT RELEASE THE NAME OF ANIMALS PRODUCING THESE AFFLICTIONS TILL SAID STUD DOG/BREEDING BITCH IS DEAD.All they can do is advise those that enquire that the said mating is ok or not.Not a good thing in my eyes but thats the way it is.BTW,where are yu from.I guess USA.Carole Spelman Rheinmeister gsds(UK)

Noddi, I can usually expect a reply from you. I am in Australia but born and bred in the North east  of England

Yes I agree, I myself still would NOT out any dog concerned but at the end of the day I really wonder about the true quality of the dogs that are imported here.

Congenital means "present at birth" and covers problems that are both accidents of development and formation and genetic problems. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Congenital_disorder

Genetic/inherited problems are those that are a result of the combination of the dam and sire's genes.

But many problems happen because something went wrong during the formation process in the womb or even at the time of birth--these include things like liver shunts, puppies that don't thrive and die in the first couple of weeks. Other problems can be either inherited or developmental/formation problems--which is where it gets tricky.  Or it might be an inherited condition that is "complex" -- not a single gene and not predictably reproducible in test breedings (it seems like PRAA and Exocrine Enzyme Insufficiency both fit this). And some problems are inherited but the genes are present in virtually all members of the breed--such as hip dysplaysia.

I think it is important to talk about inherited problems honestly--and often the stud dog owner will discuss these things or you can contact other breeders who have had puppies out of a male. However, if you don't know whether a condition is genetic, you may be doing more harm than good both to the breed and the stud dog owner by discouraging people from breeding to a very good stud dog or from buying his already-born puppies.


Christine

DogsHome9, I wish there was some database that required mandatory reporting of genetic health problems with dogs to stop continued breeding of dogs with genetic health problems.  If the dog was to be registered and bred, the dog has to be entered into this database with all pertinent health information and information of its offspring.  I have a friend that has a dog with megaesophagus and come to find out the breeding female has produced other litters with this and hip dysplasia, now she has a dog that she can't use for work.  Another friend of mine purchased a puppy from a local breeder and come to find out that breeder falsified OFAs and her pup has such severe hip dysplasia that she euthanized him (he couldn't walk well let alone squat to go potty at 4 years old, necropsy confirmed the diagnosis).  Last I knew, both breeders are still producing "top quality working dogs" (per their advertisements).

Unfortunately, AKC is not into the idea of forcing mandatory spaying and neutering of dogs that have proven heritable health problems.  They knew of certian champion dogs that bred into the next generation some pretty terrible genetic health issues and did nothing about it.  It is the elephant in the room, only they (and those disreputable breeders) view it as an elephant with rabies, if no one even looks at it, it won't go rampant and destroy everything.