*Bartmess dogs* - Page 4

DDR dogs are bred like crazy just for being DDR dogs. I've never met one that was worth a crap. People who think they are have just never handled WG.

Perpetuating the myth that big dark dogs with raccoon eyes are some kind of superior GSD is just playing into the hands of the HUNDREDS of ddr puppymills springing up all over this country.

FAD FAD FAD

 I have met a few that were very nice and had a bit of a different spin on their temperaments than the average. However, that all went out the window when they got to be so trendy, so now they're mostly being bred to be couch potato pets and I think that is where a lot of the temperament issues are coming in- people simply don't care. They know they won't be held accountable because most of the people they're selling to don't know their ass from a hole in the ground. 

Another thing.......people advertise "DDR" and don't even know what the hell it is. I click on a lot of the DDR ads I see out of curiosity now. Recently, I saw an ad for a DDR female. Here's her pedigree (not the dog for sale, but identical pedigree), LMAO: http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/german_shepherd_dog/dog.html?id=479555

It's become nothing but a marketing ploy, same as anything else. People do the same with "rare" black dogs. SSDD.

 Anyone who sent a dog to this person should be shunned.

I am amused at all the breeders on line being so strict on who can breed dogs and have litters.  I have nothing to gain in this case, except to put in my 2 cents.  I realize that abuse can't be tolerated.  Puppy milling the worst of dog crimes.  That being said....I sit back and listen to people talk about "charrished" companions....while they breed their own litters.  I have no faith in Rescue.  As so much profit is made there as well, depending on who is doing the rescueing.  Every one wants to be the sherriff.  Before the DNA kits made cheating a little more difficult.....Rescue was an atrocity.  I am speaking of where I live.  The shelters have "breed rescue" and "BREEDERS come into the shelters and pick up all the purebreds.  Many things are done with these dogs....from breeding "who needs papers" to protection dogs...you name it.  Purebreds are given to "breed rescue" without being spayed or neutered.  Because the "breed Rescue" will take dcare of that.  RIGHT!!!  Some dogs really do get rescued...and some are still used for many things.  A lot of money changes hands in the name of rescue.  I have no problem with making ends meet.  But call it what it is.  Rescue for profit.  Breeders only care that one or 20 more dogs are taken out of the "breeding race".  And I am talaking about all breeds...not just GSD.  People can and do make mistakes.  Biggest mistake a person will ever make is to give their dog to a "professional" and not check up on them.  You get what you get if that is the way you do business.  That being said.....its a tough business and you need to be on your toes.  Because we are all trying to preserve the breed....and improve it.  RIGHT!!   Here is the perfect example...and then I will leave it alone....I am looking for a "companion GSD" for a 83 year old man who isvery lonly.  He just lost his wife...and then his GSD.  He is good with dogs...but doesn't need a hard prey driven dog.  So I went to A GSD rescue...the dog I was interested in had been taken from a shelter three days earlier.  They knew very little about this dog.  He was calm and well behaved.  thin, but other wise a nice PET.  She wanted 850.00 for her exspences.  EXCUSE ME???  Sshe had him for three day, he is still in tact...and she incurred 850.00 of exspences???  Yeah right......my dogs can fly!!!!!  Rescue and Breeding are still in bed together.  AKC papers don't mean alot to main stream America these days.  With ten registries for every breed popping up.  AKC can only do so much.  Breeders need to re examine their reasons for wanting rescue dogs to be just Pets... A lot of it is competition, being put out of the running.  Not for the love of the dogs or the breed.  At least be honest about it.  Now all of you can flame me...   

 Now that I've simmered down I think I can post a bit more calmy on this thread again..

@ Vonissk, I agree with you. I also have been totally shocked by some of the people who have stepped up and defended Janice, Dominguez and Malone on this board. Some of that comes from not knowing screen names and kennel names. It's a lot to remember and memories do fade. For many though, there is no excuse.  I'll not address this futher on this particular thread. Trying to stay a little on topic here.

@ demeras, if the truth brings flaming then I suppose I will be on the stake right next to you. There is good and bad rescue out there just like anything else. People need to speak up, name names and get the word out about so called "rescue" too. Everything you said and then some does happen and it happens often. 

It all comes down to an individuals willingness to step up and do something. So many people today just don't care enough to be bothered with making any effort. It's much easier to complain to thin air, shrug it off and let it go. 

 Demeras, you sadly have a lot of very valid points, though I'm not aware of a better system at the moment. I think rescues are very much individual and some are absolutely altruistic and some are exactly as you describe. I have had a few experiences with both kinds. 

Vonissk, YES- that's the type I'm talking about. As far as I've seen, it's all but gone from DDR lines. Now I try to find those traits wherever I can. Temperament, temperament, temperament. Some of those dogs had true character. Much more sound physically/gentically, and yes, impressive as hell to look at. I have not come across but maybe ONE "pure" DDR line dog who has impressed me in both body and mind since I've been actively seeking dogs for breeding. I blame breeders like we've been talking about for this; what purpose could they possibly be breeding for besides money, and when you don't breed for a purpose, you get, well, you get the crap people are labeling "DDR dogs." 

I, too, have sent some PMs to people on their wacky and ignorant ads.

The best thing for the remaining DDR bloodlines would be to fall out of public favor. 

It's a real shame that some of the genetics she has (or claims to have) will be lost. Almost all DDR dogs today come from line 13-A. I'm not sure what she has or doesn't have but if she does have really old blood then it is possible that some of the traits that the good DDR dogs were known for could be revived. Having said that....I do not believe anyone today should have those types of dogs. Actually those dogs she has should probably be put down. That would solve the bickering would it not? Over where they are going and what they will be used for! All I see is bickering (except for 2 or 3 people) when heads should be put together and collectively help these dogs. It is a sad soceity we live in that we must spay and neuter dogs to prevent them from being used negatively. There also seems to  be a double standard for many. All our dogs are used for some sort of personal gain even if that is only companionship. I don't see breeding as abuse but common sense would suggest that there are too many dogs in the world and therefore more breeding is detrimental for all. A sad world indeed. Lets not forget about the person that was neglected/abused.

Hey, after someone tried to steal my Fero daughter, I had her spayed and everybody left me alone. They didn't give a crap about her....just her ovaries.

I can only hope the the Bartmess pair get serious jail time for what they did to that old lady. If THAT scene doesn't give you a glimpse into their mentality, I don't know what does. It should prove beyond the shadow of a doubt that they had NO GOOD INTENTIONS WHATSOEVER. The old lady probably had little use to them except for her social security checks. 

demaras wrote:

"So I went to A GSD rescue...the dog I was interested in had been taken from a shelter three days earlier. They knew very little about this dog. He was calm and well behaved. thin, but other wise a nice PET. She wanted 850.00 for her exspences. EXCUSE ME??? Sshe had him for three day, he is still in tact...and she incurred 850.00 of exspences??? "

Did she have $850.00 worth of expenses in THAT dog? No.  And I won't argue that $850.00 seems awfully steep for an adoption fee, at least to me.  But I suspect you would have been just as unhappy with an adoption fee of $400.00, or maybe even $200.00, based on the fact that the rescue had only pulled the dog from the shelter 3 days earlier and there wasn't even time for him to have been neutered yet.  And if this was the SOLE dog this person was rescuing and rehoming, I might agree with you there, too. 

But a responsible rescue group has to factor their overall expenses for ALL the dogs they serve into the adoption fees they set.  While one dog may require nothing more than a basic health check, vaccinations and sterilization, another may need surgeries to repair hit-by-car injuries, while still another may be in foster care for a year or more before the right match of a person comes along.  Should the hit-by-car dog's adoption fee be higher because of the medical care he needed? Should the dog whose Mr. or Ms. Right doesn't find them for a year have a higher fee because there wasn't a good fit immediately?  And if those fees should be higher than the dog who needed nothing much done, how likely do you think it is that those 'needier' dogs will get adopted? 

Again, I won't argue that there aren't those who portray themselves as 'rescuers' who are really just 'dog jockeys' looking to make a quick buck at a dog's expense...but a rescue that does right by the dogs it takes in MUST establish adoption fees that equitably distribute the expenses of operating the rescue for all the dogs, past and present, while still remaining a reasonable fee that won't discourage potential adoptors.

Oh, and one more thing--it's not unheard of for a rescue to quote an outrageous fee to someone they would rather not adopt a dog out to...breeders have been known to do so as well.  It's less confrontational than having to tell someone directly that you wouldn't adopt a dog to them if they were the last person on earth who was looking for one.  Not saying that's what happened in this case, just sayin' that it HAS been known to happen...