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by Videx on 07 April 2010 - 18:04
Dingo..... Delusional - the one who is delusional is a person who has little or no knowledge of the correct International GSD, and believes that every current SV Judge is WRONG in respect of the correct conformation of the GSD.
Someone who writes the comment (below), amongst many other similar comments. According to you Gary Gray and his ilk know what the "correct GSD" should look like and the SV is wrong! Now that really is delusional! YOU are totally delusional regarding the "correct international GSD"
Katrina Doble wrote: (on timesonline)
Barbara - I fail to see how you cannot see the curvature of the spine (roach) which begins behind the withers (crikey - in some you could almost describe it as a hump) on the showline dogs. Stacked or otherwise, there should be no abrupt break in the topline. There is a term in psychotherapy called 'deletion' which is when you see what you want to see and not what is actually there.
Someone who writes the comment (below), amongst many other similar comments. According to you Gary Gray and his ilk know what the "correct GSD" should look like and the SV is wrong! Now that really is delusional! YOU are totally delusional regarding the "correct international GSD"
Katrina Doble wrote: (on timesonline)
Barbara - I fail to see how you cannot see the curvature of the spine (roach) which begins behind the withers (crikey - in some you could almost describe it as a hump) on the showline dogs. Stacked or otherwise, there should be no abrupt break in the topline. There is a term in psychotherapy called 'deletion' which is when you see what you want to see and not what is actually there.
by Dingodog on 07 April 2010 - 21:04
Videx I thought you were retiring..........
This is becoming so monotonous, I give up, and leave you all in peace to be in harmonious agreement with each other.
This is becoming so monotonous, I give up, and leave you all in peace to be in harmonious agreement with each other.
by Dingodog on 07 April 2010 - 21:04
Carole
I am about 30/40 miles away from Maidstone. I will keep my eye open for something down your way, but with attitudes displayed on the board generally (not by you), I think that I would not feel welcome so there really seems little point. Still, as I said, showing does not much interest me. We will continue with our agility competitions. You and I obviously like the same kind of dog though :)
I am about 30/40 miles away from Maidstone. I will keep my eye open for something down your way, but with attitudes displayed on the board generally (not by you), I think that I would not feel welcome so there really seems little point. Still, as I said, showing does not much interest me. We will continue with our agility competitions. You and I obviously like the same kind of dog though :)
by pacosbear on 07 April 2010 - 22:04
by Sue B on 07 April 2010 - 23:04
Brilliant Liz, well spotted, an excellent article which addresses the relevant points and sums up the ABS perfectly. Seems we GSD folk are not alone with our thoughts on how useless, toothless and misleading the KC AB Scheme is after all then (not that I ever thought that we were) !!. What say you now Dingodog, do you still believe the KC ABS was set up purely in the best interests of Dogdom ? Surely, no real genuine dog lover would still want to defend this KC farce.
You may be wondering why I didn't answer the last questions you asked me, well thats because just like the KC you managed to totally evade the most important question that I asked you which was (I repeat);- "When it comes to the Breeds health, where exactly do you believe we should compromise????"
Regards
Sue b
You may be wondering why I didn't answer the last questions you asked me, well thats because just like the KC you managed to totally evade the most important question that I asked you which was (I repeat);- "When it comes to the Breeds health, where exactly do you believe we should compromise????"
Regards
Sue b
by pacosbear on 07 April 2010 - 23:04
Sue B
I believe that Dingodog is well aware of this article and several others articles which can be accessed from the same link. Although these dont serve her purpose here.
Perhaps she will remember posting a comment elsewhere "Lets slam doors in faces – reduce outlets, and insist that the only dogs that can be made available for sale are from certified health tested parents – which is checkable".
I believe that Dingodog is well aware of this article and several others articles which can be accessed from the same link. Although these dont serve her purpose here.
Perhaps she will remember posting a comment elsewhere "Lets slam doors in faces – reduce outlets, and insist that the only dogs that can be made available for sale are from certified health tested parents – which is checkable".
by Dingodog on 08 April 2010 - 08:04
Pacosbear
Thank you for posting that. Perhaps you will now all believe what I have always said all along, that I believe that we should have mandatory health testing, and that has always been my view. Search any forum you like and you will find more of the same. You may even find some very disparaging comments I have made in the past about the KC :)
I suspect this is from another board (no I can't remember when or where), and the context was commercial puppy farming. That is, puppy farmers who supply intermediaries who purchase the puppies 'in bulk' and then sell them to Pet Shops. These puppies are not registered with the KC. Now that Pacosbear has CONFIRMED that I support mandatory health testing and, ergo, obviously not supporting the KC, let's move on to what I actually was questioning on this thread in the first place:
Is it such a good idea though? I don't think so. Isn't this potentially going to do what everyone accused PDE of doing - driving puppy buyers to pet shops and backyard breeders? I would consider carefully what the implications of such action will be for the GSD and other breeds in general.
Pacosbear posting the comment from another thread simply confirms that I held the same view back whenever that was and I hold the same view now.
My perception was that this was being done mostly to 'get back' at the KC because of what is happening with the KC and the breed right now. If it wasn't, why would you not have undertaken such a 'campaign' against the scheme years ago? Why now? That was my point. it was also my contention that there are many good breeders registered with the KC, your good selves included, whether under the ABS or not, and whilst DP delights in the fact that they may not be able to sell their puppies, and be tarred with the same brush as bad breeders, I for one think that such a sentiment is appalling. What I thought was even worse was the lack of health information provided to the public by the League, that has been conspicuous by it's absence for years, bearing in mind that the KC suggests that they contact the Breed Clubs/councils for more information. The target should be the KC, directly, and only the KC.
I hope that the recommendations in the APGAW report will force the KC into further action, and will also disadvantage those breeders who do not health test. I don't want to see decent people get caught in your crossfire. That's it.
Thank you for posting that. Perhaps you will now all believe what I have always said all along, that I believe that we should have mandatory health testing, and that has always been my view. Search any forum you like and you will find more of the same. You may even find some very disparaging comments I have made in the past about the KC :)
I suspect this is from another board (no I can't remember when or where), and the context was commercial puppy farming. That is, puppy farmers who supply intermediaries who purchase the puppies 'in bulk' and then sell them to Pet Shops. These puppies are not registered with the KC. Now that Pacosbear has CONFIRMED that I support mandatory health testing and, ergo, obviously not supporting the KC, let's move on to what I actually was questioning on this thread in the first place:
Is it such a good idea though? I don't think so. Isn't this potentially going to do what everyone accused PDE of doing - driving puppy buyers to pet shops and backyard breeders? I would consider carefully what the implications of such action will be for the GSD and other breeds in general.
Pacosbear posting the comment from another thread simply confirms that I held the same view back whenever that was and I hold the same view now.
My perception was that this was being done mostly to 'get back' at the KC because of what is happening with the KC and the breed right now. If it wasn't, why would you not have undertaken such a 'campaign' against the scheme years ago? Why now? That was my point. it was also my contention that there are many good breeders registered with the KC, your good selves included, whether under the ABS or not, and whilst DP delights in the fact that they may not be able to sell their puppies, and be tarred with the same brush as bad breeders, I for one think that such a sentiment is appalling. What I thought was even worse was the lack of health information provided to the public by the League, that has been conspicuous by it's absence for years, bearing in mind that the KC suggests that they contact the Breed Clubs/councils for more information. The target should be the KC, directly, and only the KC.
I hope that the recommendations in the APGAW report will force the KC into further action, and will also disadvantage those breeders who do not health test. I don't want to see decent people get caught in your crossfire. That's it.
by missbeeb on 08 April 2010 - 09:04
Dingo, Most people (I hope) don't want to "get back" at the KC... we want to be free of their unhealthy restrictions, half truths and lies.
"Get back" could, however, be appropriately applied to their ridicule of the BoB winner at crufts! We're a big pain in the ass for the KC... ALWAYS have been! The GSD people in the UK have ALWAYS led the way re health testing and the KC have seldom made it easy.
Glad you have the interests of the breed at heart... so do we, Dingo! Those of us that have finally given up trying to convince the KC, are unlikely to "go there again" imo. We're sick to death of being beaten by the KC stick for wanting things that would improve the lot of our dogs and indeed, dogdom in general. This is not recent, you're wrong to assume that it hasn't been going on, just because you haven't heard about it.
I look forward to meeting you in person one day, when you can see many of our dogs, because I know (?) you will then be able to see what we see.
by Dingodog on 08 April 2010 - 09:04
As I said Missbeeb - my perception, and of course I am not the only one forming a perception.
I know it has been going on a little, but everyone seemed to get a little carried away in the heat of the moment that's all. All I was trying to say was stop and think. This is all in the public eye now, and the KC also have to consider their position on this. I think now is the time things could change - we'll see.
Hope you believe me now :)
I know it has been going on a little, but everyone seemed to get a little carried away in the heat of the moment that's all. All I was trying to say was stop and think. This is all in the public eye now, and the KC also have to consider their position on this. I think now is the time things could change - we'll see.
Hope you believe me now :)
by missbeeb on 08 April 2010 - 09:04
It's been more than a little... really!
Perception is a huge problem, (for us) the KC have a media platform with which to "beat" us... we don't, but there are a few people (like Beverley Cuddy) capable of seeing what's actually going on. We've stopped and thought for years and years... to no avail. PDE is what forced the issue with the KC... they selected "us", not Cavaliers, not Bulldogs, not Boxers... all of which DIE from their problems... go figure.
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