FRACTURED CORONOID PROCESS/UNUNITED ANCONEAL PROCESS???? - Page 1

Hi there...

I have recently recieved an e-mail from a client stating that her 15 month old pup has an ununited anconeal process. she has only been to her local vet for diagnosis and is headed down to Michigan State for futher diagnosis or second opinion. She was however informed that this is a congenital disease in Gsd's caused by something hereditarily unknown.

What can you tell me about this problem, is it indeed congenital? I am doing my own research, however it is good to have other input as well. All information is appreciated.


Shannan

one of my first females had bi-lateral UAP.  She was a working line, Harro Lechrainstadt granddaughter. The vet I used (Dr. Taylor in Rockwall) told me is was suspected to be highly heritable.  I took his word for it and did not breed the female.  everyone I talked to about it agreed with the vet.

I had a few people that did say it could have been cause by an injury to the growth plates in the elbow when the dog was younger,  but I didn't want to risk it and removed her from my program.  I can tell you the vet recommended surgery, which I could not afford.  She never showed any signs of being lame, would run until she couldn't no more, and would easily clear 6 ft kennels.  the lady I placed her with ran her 6 miles a day.  as far as I know she never needed the surgery and never showed any lameness until she was a very old girl.

Thank You....

This pup showed signs of lameness... It is a male and I do believe he is neutered, he was sold with a limited registration also. I am not aware of any problems in the lines I bred and am just trying to make sense of things. They are recommending surgery for him, making me research a little harder for answers....   :)

Thanks Again


Shannan

   my female was never lame, but she also had a high pain threshhold.
if this pup is showing signs of lameness at 15 months,  then surgery may be the way to go.  of course I would get a 2nd opinion too,  but UAP is fairly easy to see on x-rays.
   I believe my vet explained it to me like this, some cases of UAP are heritary, others are not.  but there really isn't a forsure way of knowing if your dog has the heritary form or if it just happened.  if this is your first one out of the mother, I would just keep it in mind with future breedings.  if you continue to have UAP cases out of her pups, or relatives, I would cull the line from the breeding program. 

I didn't get too much help from my females breeder as she isnsisted it wasn't inherited and the dog should be bred.  infact she went as far as to contact the person I placed the dog with to arrange a breeding to her stud.  luckily I hadn't transferred the papers to the new owner and I never signed papers for her litter to be reg.  I was so angry that they went ahead and bred her.  but I learned my mistake and will net let another dog with a known health problem leave my house intact.

Yes, this is the first pup out of three litteres to have a problem. I was quite shocked at the news. I am keeping a close eye for future problems and will stop future breeding if this is a problem.

Thanks  :)

All experts agree that UAP (especially in GSD) is hereditary not congenital.  I'm sorry that it happened to one of your baby..I don't know of one breeder (working or show) that has been there for a while who wasn't face with this situation...me included.
This is why we should put emphasis on breeding only normal to normal elbows.  Not even a grade 1 DJD because we still don't know how it happened and why.  We know that it runs in certain line and that certain dogs keep giving this defect.

The ones I had (two in the same litter, males)  came from 2 parents that were normal and had 5 generation of elbow certified free from the disease..but still it happened..

Male are 4 times more affected than females. 

Did you have other litter with that female?? sometimes it's the match between the two.

I had kept a female from this breeding and after the diagnosis I neutered her and sold her as a pet (she was ok).  I also neutered the mother.  I always sell my pups with non-breeding agreements until they attain a championship and are certified HIP and Elbows..all the others in the litter were sold as pet anyways..

This is a very big problem in GSD..I think breeders are more and more aware and I hope they will pay the same attention as it was for hip dyplasia wich is much better than it was..

Good luck and again i'm sorry you have to go trough this..

Julie

I have always viewed "congenital" as just another word for "hereditary".

Regardless, UAP is a very long standing issue in the GSD. It is also very unlikely to ever be totally eliminated, the same as H/D.

Good breeding practices can go a long way in improving this condition.

Not sure what you are asking, but yes, this condition is a direct result of heredity and the choices one makes in breeding.

Also, it is unlikely that it will ever be completely eliminated in the GSD.

However, if you consider yourself an ethical breeder, then the final responsibility for this condition in a pup you bred and sold is yours.

And, I do not mean this in any disrespectful manner, just the way it is.

Best,

Rik

Posted by Rik on 04 August 2009 - 02:08

I have always viewed "congenital" as just another word for "hereditary".

They're not one and the same.  Something can be congenital without being hereditary, and something else can be hereditary without being congenital, while still another issue can be both congenital and hereditary.  "Congenital" is defined as being present at birth; "hereditary" is defined as being a genetic characteristic that is transmitted from parent to offspring. 

hexe, I understand where you are coming from.

Congential can be defined as a condition that "may or may not be genetic".

Congenital syphilis is not genetic, UAP is genetic.

Best,
Rik

Thank You all for your input, I am awaiting the diagnosis from Michigan State on what exactly this is and so forth....

Shannan  :)