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by Hutchins on 03 February 2013 - 22:02
Darylehert wrote:
"Basically, your topic isn't about the dog at all [despite your question]. You simply came on here to air your dirty laundry about a breeder you dislike. I know of others that hold her in low regard, so you're not alone."
Despite what you think or believe, I did not come on here to air dirty laundry about a breeder I dislike. I don't even know her. I have yet to speak to her about this situation, I have never bought a dog or puppy from her. So for you to say I came to air laundry about a breeder I dislike, is really way off base. Thats the problem with alot of these threads. People read way too much in them and make assumptions instead of just reading them for the purpose they were written..
" Do you suppose as a rule, that every breeder should take back a monster CREATED? I'd have to sit on the fence with that notion, just depends on many details."
Since you are asking me this question, I can only answer it as I would do. YES, If we are the breeders on the dog in question, I would DEFINITELY take it back. I could not conciously allow this dog to possibly end up God only knows where. Regardless of how bad it is, I WANT IT BACK!! I might have to pick the dog up and go straight to the vet to PTS, but I know in my heart I did the right thing for the dog, if its that bad. Also for myself as an ethical breeder trying to do the right thing. JMO.
"I don't recall you stating that YOU offered her to the breeder, and that doesn't make sense when reading what you originally wrote..."
I did not verbal offer her to the breeder because she didn't let me get any farther than saying what the phone call was about, and then she hung up. Below is what I wrote in another comment I posted in this same thread. Clearly it states I offered her the dog back in 2 separate emails. Guess since you didn't read all comment under this thread is why you didn't see I offered her the dog back.
Hutchins wrote:
I have sent her two emails asking her if she wanted the dog back, and also mention that if she did not want to help me I was going to ask here on the PDB. That was about 2 weeks ago, and as of today, I have not heard from her. That speaks volumes for her as a breeder.
"Basically, your topic isn't about the dog at all [despite your question]. You simply came on here to air your dirty laundry about a breeder you dislike. I know of others that hold her in low regard, so you're not alone."
Despite what you think or believe, I did not come on here to air dirty laundry about a breeder I dislike. I don't even know her. I have yet to speak to her about this situation, I have never bought a dog or puppy from her. So for you to say I came to air laundry about a breeder I dislike, is really way off base. Thats the problem with alot of these threads. People read way too much in them and make assumptions instead of just reading them for the purpose they were written..
" Do you suppose as a rule, that every breeder should take back a monster CREATED? I'd have to sit on the fence with that notion, just depends on many details."
Since you are asking me this question, I can only answer it as I would do. YES, If we are the breeders on the dog in question, I would DEFINITELY take it back. I could not conciously allow this dog to possibly end up God only knows where. Regardless of how bad it is, I WANT IT BACK!! I might have to pick the dog up and go straight to the vet to PTS, but I know in my heart I did the right thing for the dog, if its that bad. Also for myself as an ethical breeder trying to do the right thing. JMO.
"I don't recall you stating that YOU offered her to the breeder, and that doesn't make sense when reading what you originally wrote..."
I did not verbal offer her to the breeder because she didn't let me get any farther than saying what the phone call was about, and then she hung up. Below is what I wrote in another comment I posted in this same thread. Clearly it states I offered her the dog back in 2 separate emails. Guess since you didn't read all comment under this thread is why you didn't see I offered her the dog back.
Hutchins wrote:
I have sent her two emails asking her if she wanted the dog back, and also mention that if she did not want to help me I was going to ask here on the PDB. That was about 2 weeks ago, and as of today, I have not heard from her. That speaks volumes for her as a breeder.
by Hutchins on 03 February 2013 - 22:02
Desert Dog,
I agree with you, if the devil had a dog I wanted I would deal with him. Like you say, I never let someone else's experience influence me about another person. The only experience I ever had with her concerning one of her dogs is with this girl. Therefore even though it is not a very good one, I can only base my opinion on that one experience. If she would talk to me and try to answer my questions about her breeding, I may have a different opinion of her as a breeder.
Once again I did not mean for this to turn into a bshing of anyone. I was hoping to get answer from more experienced people than myself about Czech bloodlines. Some dogs have a tendency to produce certain traits where others don't. That is what I was trying to find out. But it is human nature that things get twisted and redirected. No big deal.
ALthough I have been accuse of airing out dirty laundry about a breeder I supposedly don't like, that was not at all my intentions!! Hell I don't even really know this person other than this experience and what I have read on here in the last 30 minutes, concerning her. Still I would not base my opinion on what I read, but I would be cautious if I had any future dealings with her. JMO
I agree with you, if the devil had a dog I wanted I would deal with him. Like you say, I never let someone else's experience influence me about another person. The only experience I ever had with her concerning one of her dogs is with this girl. Therefore even though it is not a very good one, I can only base my opinion on that one experience. If she would talk to me and try to answer my questions about her breeding, I may have a different opinion of her as a breeder.
Once again I did not mean for this to turn into a bshing of anyone. I was hoping to get answer from more experienced people than myself about Czech bloodlines. Some dogs have a tendency to produce certain traits where others don't. That is what I was trying to find out. But it is human nature that things get twisted and redirected. No big deal.
ALthough I have been accuse of airing out dirty laundry about a breeder I supposedly don't like, that was not at all my intentions!! Hell I don't even really know this person other than this experience and what I have read on here in the last 30 minutes, concerning her. Still I would not base my opinion on what I read, but I would be cautious if I had any future dealings with her. JMO
by GSDPACK on 03 February 2013 - 23:02
Call Ramona personally and talk to her about the parents. since she raised and trained them, she should be able to give you some pointers. If she does not talk to you.... then you will probably have to find other means of information. When it comes t the pedigree.. I don't see anything that screams red flags. Not my type of a pairing, but I don't know the parents personally, how they are, their nerves...so on. Finding someone who can help you channel her energy and maybe getting a first hand input from the breeder would be my best bet.
Good luck and I sure hope you guys find a way to live with her.
Good luck and I sure hope you guys find a way to live with her.
by Hutchins on 04 February 2013 - 05:02
GSDPack,
I have tried to contact Ramona by phone and by email. When I told her what my call was about, she hung up on me. Since I did not get the dog from her, she suggest I talk to the person I got her from. I sent her two emails asking her for help. I told her since she was the breeder and owned both parents I figured she could provide me with a few answers concerning the pedigree of this girl As of today I still haven't heard from her. That is why I turned to this forum for help. I am not that experienced with Czech bloodlines and was hoping I could get help with more knowledgeable people concerning Czech pedigrees.
Regardless, we will do our dammest to work with this girl She is not our first high drive dog, but the first that can not be capped. Just have to keep trying different things till we figure out what will work for her. Sad part is, she is such a sweet girl and so willing to please, she just don't know how to contain herself.
We are ready to give up that easy on her!
I have tried to contact Ramona by phone and by email. When I told her what my call was about, she hung up on me. Since I did not get the dog from her, she suggest I talk to the person I got her from. I sent her two emails asking her for help. I told her since she was the breeder and owned both parents I figured she could provide me with a few answers concerning the pedigree of this girl As of today I still haven't heard from her. That is why I turned to this forum for help. I am not that experienced with Czech bloodlines and was hoping I could get help with more knowledgeable people concerning Czech pedigrees.
Regardless, we will do our dammest to work with this girl She is not our first high drive dog, but the first that can not be capped. Just have to keep trying different things till we figure out what will work for her. Sad part is, she is such a sweet girl and so willing to please, she just don't know how to contain herself.
We are ready to give up that easy on her!
by GSDPACK on 04 February 2013 - 05:02
That sucks that the breeder blew you off. Seems like first hand info is not available.
My suggestion would be this: teach her to find a scent (I do oranges, friend of mine does potatoes, another friend I have does a bumper) Teach her to search for the object. Start small, living room, visible sites, even toss it for her, then move to larger area, include other rooms, then move out. When I need to tire my dogs out and I have finals in school.. I set up very dificult searches and let them work their asses off. Remember you need to build the stamina, ethics and success. She will need to learn to overcome problems and obstacles.
When I took Orin to Nationals to do his FH, the track he worked.... man, he worked so hard he was mentaly exhausted! He came to the hotel room and crashed..LOL poor guy. So tracking and problem solving and building stamina will help you to tire her out a little.
Good luck I hope this could work for you guys.
My suggestion would be this: teach her to find a scent (I do oranges, friend of mine does potatoes, another friend I have does a bumper) Teach her to search for the object. Start small, living room, visible sites, even toss it for her, then move to larger area, include other rooms, then move out. When I need to tire my dogs out and I have finals in school.. I set up very dificult searches and let them work their asses off. Remember you need to build the stamina, ethics and success. She will need to learn to overcome problems and obstacles.
When I took Orin to Nationals to do his FH, the track he worked.... man, he worked so hard he was mentaly exhausted! He came to the hotel room and crashed..LOL poor guy. So tracking and problem solving and building stamina will help you to tire her out a little.
Good luck I hope this could work for you guys.
by workingdogz on 04 February 2013 - 10:02
Pretty sure the rescue that Ms BeeTree adopted the baby Rhino Beau
from had issues with this breeder as well, if memory is correct the same
breeder had a dog or two (or more) end up with that particular rescue,
and the breeder didn't care as the dogs were spayed or neutered.
http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/forum.read?mnr=349840-breeder-bitch-time-again-tom-z-ps-granddaughter-for-adoption
Oh yup, I was right!
No surprise she wouldn't assist OP 
from had issues with this breeder as well, if memory is correct the same
breeder had a dog or two (or more) end up with that particular rescue,
and the breeder didn't care as the dogs were spayed or neutered.
http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/forum.read?mnr=349840-breeder-bitch-time-again-tom-z-ps-granddaughter-for-adoption
Oh yup, I was right!
No surprise she wouldn't assist OP 
by laura271 on 04 February 2013 - 13:02
I see many similarities to my male (Czech lines) GSD in the description of your female. I agree with GSDPACK's advice - we developed a fervent love of tracking and the Suche game since this type of activity mentally exhausts Bosco. Bosco will swim until he vomits and then immediately go right back in the lake - meaning no amount of physical exercise will ever make him stop moving. We started the Suche game as GSDPACK described - a tug hidden in the living room, then the backyard, then a small park (ie. hide the toy on the slide, etc.) until now we take him to the woods, put him in an out of sight stay, hide the toy, return to him, and then tell him to find it. Heeling practice every single freakin' day is also a requirement - lots of figure 8's (no dropping focus on the inside turns!), left hand quarter turns, left and right spirals, etc. Friends are always shocked that Bosco is an excellent house dog but he's given an outlet for his energy.
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