Any Herding Titled Breeders - Page 2

Since you have a sheep farm, I am presuming that first and foremost you want working stock dogs as opposed to trial dogs , is that correct? If so a word of warning re some "titled" herding dogs in the US if their titles are AKC rather than HGH or AHBA or ICBC.

The AKC has been running in fear from PETA criticism for a number of years and thus a dog actively working stock that shows any energy, speed or enthusiasm is heavily penalized if not outright dismissed. Tho rules have changed over the years, from the beginning it was a fault based scoring system with the result the dog could complete the chore (the course) within the time allowed and still not pass. Over the years it has increasingly become a system that encourages what I call robot or obedience herding where virtually every footstep is directed by the handler. Any natural ability the dog may have brought to the table is suppressed - oft by mr. buzzy. Part of the problem is AKC trials tend to use for their A course 3 very flighty sheep in an arena that often is not large enough for a GSD to get sufficiently far enough away to find a natural balance point that allows calm movement of the stock. This can easily turn into a rodeo thus the increasing selection for robot dogs. So often the selection is not for a dog with true herding drive but one with a minimal interest and/or low presence/power that then can be shaped to look like it's herding.

Secondly unfortunately there has often been a contentious relationship between those who exhibit on Courses A (arena or Asca style) and B (BC or open field distance gather) and those who only compete on course C  (Continental or large flock)- and have continously tried to get AKC to limit GSD participation to course C. Course C was intended to mimic the HGH but there are many differences starting with the # of stock. Many of the American show line dogs especially the East Coast ones only compete in C and much like club level schutzhund dogs will only compete on the home training grounds. While there are some nice working dogs with course C titles it is a buyer beware situation. Judicious questioning and video proof of the pudding is in order imho. Many of these dogs may look great on the graze but lack fetching, driving, holding, splitting skills - the skills that are used in everyday stock management. I know of several course C handlers who maintain a BC to do those kind of bothersome stock tasks. Now me, I'm a one dog person and that one dog better be able to do everything a herding dog needs to do.

NB sent you a pm

I have a young male competing in AKC herding now. He took High in Trial in February for his 3 day weekend on Started Ducks and Started Sheep A course. He is currently being trained and handled by Molly Wisecarver in Arizona. We intend to take him all the way to Herding Champion in Advanced A Course. Once that is completed, I would like to see him in C course. Here is his pedigree http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/german_shepherd_dog/dog.html?id=2315386-union-rags-von-sentinelharts His maternal grandmother is HGH titled and both parents are IPO titled. He is too young to stud now but should be ready in 2017. Preliminary xrays show passing orthopedics. www.sentinelharts.com Camilla

Von Wolkstal.com is planning on two breedings involving 2 Kirschental dogs and 1 Kirschental dog.

Team members are Sharon Cullman, Loren & Mary Lengacher, Tom & Horole Ann Kerr, Linda Smith. Think they are in WA. Seen two huge ads.

Think there is someone in the area north of San Diego Co, CA. and one or two places with a dog or two out Kirschental in FL.

Know absolutely nothing about the owners and/or the dogs. Just providing some leads.

"HGH" offspring is not different to "IPO" offspring, "workingline" offspring, "real dog" offspring, or anything else.
"Son" or "daughter" of xyz doesn´t help, as long as the dog in question didn´t proof its working ability.
Ancestors are able to give you a tendency, a higher percentage of success, but without proof no certainty.

A kennel name is no guarantor for a dog, able to do the job ...it´s just a kennel name... you need proof.

Bump.

I have Toby vom Kirschental in Northern California. He just turned 2, and I hope to have him breed surveyed in 2017. (fingers crossed) His brother, Timon, is in Germany and is being used as a stud - I am just not as talented to get him titled so fast.

Sharon is vom Wolfstal (not wolkstal) :)