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by SitasMom on 01 November 2010 - 03:11
by gsdsch3v on 01 November 2010 - 06:11
thank you for posting the bitework video. Definetly appreciate the time to put those together and upload them. It is nice to get to see them on video at least if you can't get to the show. It does look better than in past years, however I still believe that this is a function of the fact that humans are inherantly lazy and will take the path of least resistance required- since the standards have been creeping up loh and behold the performances creep up also with training time and effort. ;)
by Mr Ready on 01 November 2010 - 12:11
by SitasMom on 01 November 2010 - 13:11
Maybe it's more about risk then laziness.
Since VA dogs are worth several thousands of dollars, Could it be that the owners are concerned that they might be injured while doing protection work. Maybe the owners only do enough to keep the dogs biting enough to pass at the shows?
Since VA dogs are worth several thousands of dollars, Could it be that the owners are concerned that they might be injured while doing protection work. Maybe the owners only do enough to keep the dogs biting enough to pass at the shows?
by DeesWolf on 01 November 2010 - 14:11
This is a serious question, as I am noticing a trend in performance tests...What happened to the stick hits? Granted in most of the video footage you are unable to see the dog on the sleeve in the attack out of the blind and drive and you can also see the judge is unable to see the grip on sleeve. However, the ones you can see, it is clear that the stick hits are basically non-existant. I noticed the same thing in the videos from the German Sieger Show.
Congratulations to TeMar for having the only dog I saw on the videos worth the rating of pronounced! Well done! Nice to see a dog with heart at the performance test.
The other performance tests aren't worth commenting on.
Congratulations to TeMar for having the only dog I saw on the videos worth the rating of pronounced! Well done! Nice to see a dog with heart at the performance test.
The other performance tests aren't worth commenting on.
by YogieBear on 01 November 2010 - 16:11
Hey Rik - thanks for the info.
you had stated:
the dogs doing the protection phase have all been trialed and titled (subject for another thread) so this is just to allow the judge to see if they have issues with character, not to score points on them It is pass/fail.
Where they titled on this type of bite work? What is the criteria they are judged on during a show on the bite work? As well is there a routine - like in schtuzhund?
I am not trying to start any argument - I have never been to a dog show. So, this is just an educational question to inlighten me....
Best Regards.
by Rik on 01 November 2010 - 22:11
hello yogi, I will answer any question I can, because you ask seriously. And I will not present anything as correct or incorrect, only as I see it and you form your own opinion. Also there are those with much more experience than me in these matters who may correct something I say. Honestly, until recently I spent my time in American shows.
So, since you have asked, I will present my view of this in both theory and in reality.
in theory:
The dogs submitted for the protection phase are are all trialed and titled dogs. Having passed the requirements of their title. this "mini test" consists of an attack from the blind and a long bite. Also shows the dog is capable of heeling off leash. This allows both the judge and the spectators to get a more complete picture of the dog, that they may have never seen. Many people are attempting to evaluate a dog for breeding or to obtain a pup from, so this is valuable to them.
in reality.
many of these dogs are very poorly trained (because the owner only cares for show) as shown by the inability to perform the simplest of commands such as heel (or fuss).
Some suggest that many of these titles are not real, that the dog never trialed and titled in a real trial. From first hand experience, I do not disagree with them. Many have seen a Sch.3 dog run from even this very basic challenge..
So in closing, I will say this, I enjoy the show ring. I offer no excuse for what you see here. Honestly, what sensible defense can I offer. "But, they are soooo purdy". This is absurd. If many seek "purdy" there are still the few who seek correct.
I appreciate that you approach this as an adult. Who knows how some new person may be influenced because you chose to do so, instead of calling everyone with a different vision "stupid".
Rik
So, since you have asked, I will present my view of this in both theory and in reality.
in theory:
The dogs submitted for the protection phase are are all trialed and titled dogs. Having passed the requirements of their title. this "mini test" consists of an attack from the blind and a long bite. Also shows the dog is capable of heeling off leash. This allows both the judge and the spectators to get a more complete picture of the dog, that they may have never seen. Many people are attempting to evaluate a dog for breeding or to obtain a pup from, so this is valuable to them.
in reality.
many of these dogs are very poorly trained (because the owner only cares for show) as shown by the inability to perform the simplest of commands such as heel (or fuss).
Some suggest that many of these titles are not real, that the dog never trialed and titled in a real trial. From first hand experience, I do not disagree with them. Many have seen a Sch.3 dog run from even this very basic challenge..
So in closing, I will say this, I enjoy the show ring. I offer no excuse for what you see here. Honestly, what sensible defense can I offer. "But, they are soooo purdy". This is absurd. If many seek "purdy" there are still the few who seek correct.
I appreciate that you approach this as an adult. Who knows how some new person may be influenced because you chose to do so, instead of calling everyone with a different vision "stupid".
Rik
by Liesjers on 01 November 2010 - 22:11
This is the new standard of suck. The test has gotten even EASIER and the performances are WORSE.
by Jacko on 01 November 2010 - 23:11
yep just like every world qualifier scores their personal best at the worlds. Oh wait did some not score. Have you ever worked a dog, put them on a plane and flew them across the country (or just traveled regionally) to an event.
Not discussing weakness of a dog, However with the lack on entries, there are only a select few who have experience doing this and understand how it works. Which is another reason why every culb memeber does not travel to the schutzhund trials in different areas, what surface are we tracking on, blah blah.
just food for thought.
Not discussing weakness of a dog, However with the lack on entries, there are only a select few who have experience doing this and understand how it works. Which is another reason why every culb memeber does not travel to the schutzhund trials in different areas, what surface are we tracking on, blah blah.
just food for thought.
by SchaeferhundSchH on 02 November 2010 - 00:11
Wow quite a few of those performances were very poor. I would be embarrassed to be half of those people with those dogs out there.
V Griff v TeMar SchH2 looked good out there. (that was the third dog in the first video)
A majority of those show lines are very handler sensitive and are very weary of their owners presence approaching from behind..
is that a nerve issue? or a handler/owner being WAY to harsh on their dogs? Since they clearly don't spend enough time working on their dogs but expect the same obedience as top level dogs...
one of the dogs in the second video actually LAYS DOWN the woman screams so harshly at it..........
a lot of poor examples for the breed, and poor examples for showlines, and poor examples of handling. I think its multiple things causing these dogs to look like this.
I need to go watch something to cheer me up now LOL
V Griff v TeMar SchH2 looked good out there. (that was the third dog in the first video)
A majority of those show lines are very handler sensitive and are very weary of their owners presence approaching from behind..
is that a nerve issue? or a handler/owner being WAY to harsh on their dogs? Since they clearly don't spend enough time working on their dogs but expect the same obedience as top level dogs...
one of the dogs in the second video actually LAYS DOWN the woman screams so harshly at it..........
a lot of poor examples for the breed, and poor examples for showlines, and poor examples of handling. I think its multiple things causing these dogs to look like this.
I need to go watch something to cheer me up now LOL
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