Best E collar recommendations? - Page 2

I have used both dogtra and tritronics and have no complaints with either.

My personal prefence purely opinion is dogtra. I love my little 282ncp collars for most scenarios. I have a few others i use from time to time but for all of my personal dogs i use the 282 ncp system,

The upside of Dogtra is you can condition puppies or new handlers using just the pager,It produces an expectation on the part of the dog that YOU are going to cause something physical to happen with the collar ,It makes it a lot eaiser for someone who has never used a collar. and easier to 'collar condition'' the dog sans the risk of hittting the nick too high in the beginning,The 2300 is the replacement for the 1900 I think ,and it has the fast charge batteries which is a big plus

I really like the Dogtra LCD  screen too.  Makes it easier.

I had Dogtra years ago and was not working right ,traded to tri tronics and been happy with it since .the only thing do not like on mine  it has bulky sender  will not fit on your palm . my next one has to fit in my palm and have a pager and has to be tri tronic

Hi Ramhaus,
can you specify what you mean with "very,very hard dog". What is she doing wrong in your opinion?
There might might be another way to get her in shape than chasing electricity through her body
All the best
Ulf

www.k9ulf.com

E collars do not chase electricity through the body silly ??  Most people just use the nick which is a pre timed nanosecond so you would have to hit it 100 times to make 1 sec!  It contracts the muscle in that very small area between the contact points. basicly makes it seems as though something physical is happening when its not ,makes corrections uber impersonal .There is really no way to duplicate that type timing with other tools. If you hook the lead to the e-collar and coordinate the nick with the pop of the leash pretty soon you can take the leash off and Ya got yourself an invisible leash!! , Comes in handy when you need to control or communicate with the dog at a distance, For some reason sometimes people think of e-collars like that scene in One flew over the Cuckoos nest where Jack Nicholson gets shock therapy!!  In reality its more like ET phone home!!

Hi Lief,
one second is 1 billion nanoseconds, so if you dont know that, which is general knowledge, how can I believe the rest what you are saying? Electricity travels with around light speed which is about 300,000 km a second. To make the dog feel the electricity and respond a signal is required to travel from that muscle you said to the brain which is done by the nerves and nerves work with electricity. Who does know how much does the electricity from the e-collar interfers with the nerves and how much damage it can do? People might argue and say, just use low stimulus it does not do harm which I might agree with, but on the other hand its common knowledge that correction has to be given accordingly to the drive of the dog. So in the end you have to give more stimulus to make it effective, dont you? Another thing is, if someone doesnt know how to fix a problem in a different way because it has no knowledge of learning principals in mammals ( no offence, everyone has to start somewhere) how can this person make me believe he/she knows he all about this complex mechanisms? Just food for thoughts

All the best
Ulf

Not necessarily, Ulf.  But you do bring up an important issue.  What does the OP want to accomplish with the ecollar?  Many people don't understand that a hard dog is one who is resilient, but this does not mean you must use a higher stimulation to fine tune the dog.

That throws up another question. Have all this people who are using e-collars such hard dogs extremely in drive so the use of an e-collar is inevitable? I have been involved in dog training for quite a while and I am still waiting for the dog where I would say the use of an e-collar is inevitable.
Sueincc, if the the dog is resilient, does it not mean there is a great desire in the dog to get to its goal? Does it not mean a lot of energy is involved and how do you compensate this with a low stimulation? To make a resilient dog biddable you need more than just fine tuning, dont you think?
All the best
Ulf

A resilient dog is one who recovers quickly from a correction, is a dog who does not become emotional or fall apart when corrected.  Before I use an ecollar I have trained my dog with the leash and given effective corrections with the leash.  I don't progress to the ecollar because I cannot give effective leash corrections, for me,  this is an incorrect use of the ecollar.   

We  use the ecollar for fine tuning and remote stuff.  For almost everything, we do not use it at a painful level of stimulation. We  look for an ear movement, a blink, or even a licking of the lip.  An example of fine tuning would be basic position straight sits every time, but my dog reads me very well, maybe he sits a little crooked and when I turn my head slightly or move my hand slightly (things I don't even realize I am doing) then the  dog corrects  himself.  Yes, this is my fault because I am the one telegraphing the "tell", but with the ecollar, the dog learns he must be correct the first time and every time he sits.  When he is corrected he is immediately rewarded right after because he is correct. 

My dog is bananas for his ball.  We use the ball in ob.  Every once in a while my dog gets a little kookoo & doesn't want to out the ball, he wants to  possess the ball.  So I platz him, I step back, say out, if he doesn't,  he gets tapped because he understands the command, now he learns he "must every time".  This is a much cleaner kinder method than fighting with a dog in drive for the ball.

Here is another thing:  I do not hold the control, my trainer does - why?  Because I am not good enough, and I don't have fast enough reactions, but we know this, so my trainer holds the control.  This is really important because the ecollar is useless if you don't use it correctly. 

There are too many people who use the collar punitively.  Too many people who are heavy handed with the collar so the dog becomes desensitized to all but high levels.  These are the same people who have already calloused the dogs neck with the pinch, they think they have to keep upping the ante on corrections.  many times these are the same people who do not understand you never correct or train a dog if you are angry or feeling emotional.  This in my opinion is what can really end up screwing up nice dogs permanently.  It's a shame.