Sitting Problem - Page 2

 I agree with anyone who said it was my fault. i probably was to focused on building drive as a young dog with the ball instead of teaching the basics first and dealing with drive as a different subject. I am not claiming that i am a great trainer or anything but what i see from my dog is that he understands the sit very well. the problem i see is his drive for reward tells him that I dont have to sit when he is up in drive. If he is just relax he sits no problem but i train in high drive because that is picture im looking for from him. with the e-collar he has something that tells him even in high drive he must obey and then and only then he gets a reward. i have changed the timing of the rewards so the dog never knows when its coming. the collar on top of his butt physically puts his but down. now he is understanding that once his initial motion of sitting begins then he has to go even further to actually sit. again i know im not perfect in my training but im just letting you know what has worked for me AND HOW HAPPY I AM that my boy is finally doing this exercise. im sure im not the only person with this issue so i thought it would be good to post for those like me.

Do not reward the dog in the sit position anymore. If you want to reward, go back to the dog and fuss a few steps and reward. With a very high dog you can and sometimes must make the sit a dead zone. They self load when an exercise starts anyway. This will also help with the jumps as an overloaded dog usually will drop his head in anticipation and race at the jump without hitting his take-off point. They tend to hit the jump going out but clear coming back. Maybe something you can try. Good luck in your training. 

 Thanks for that advice REALCOLD. That is exactly what i started doing about three weeks ago. He then started anticipating going FOWARD because he new once we took a few steps his reward was there. He started lifting his butt and then i had to correct him which got him even higher. I have decided to make the sit an absolute dead zone for now with no reward until i see his drive go down(if ever) for the reward after the sit.  Then i will slightly build him back up a little. 

E collars, Prong collars to teach a simple obedience command, I thought we were out of the dark ages now.  I can honestly say that this is one good thing about the UK (not many of them left I admit) that these instruments of torture are rarely used for severe behavioural problems (I've only heard rumours of use never seen them used) let alone basic obedience a puppy should be doing.
If you are talking a sit wait rather than a sit stay you need to teach it so the dog doesn't always get called and you go and reward it while it is sitting not after it has moved.

Disgusted from Mayfair

Make it real dead. Walk back slow and quietly say sit as you pass by. Wander around and each time you pass say sit very quietly and slow. When he is out of drive walk by and say fuss quietly and in a low voice so you don't load him. You can then fuss away and reward or not as usually the work is the reward for the high loaders.

 Thanks that is what i will do. so far im happy with the results im getting. I have a trial in 10 days. Im going for a sch1 and 2. Its so funny that im dealing with this with a dog that is getting ready to trial but every dog has a flaw. its called the handler. lol. i am very excited to show him off because he is a better dog than i am a handler. he just turned 2 so he is doing great.

Smartguy
I give you credit for not flying off the handle at some of the hard remarks including mine,that says a lot for your temperament which is what is needed to train a dog Good Luck with your fellow keep at it and you will win the day
Steve1

 Thank you steve1

"and if they are okay then you are the one at fault not the dog for allowing it to happen in the first place"

OK thank you all, but then what do you do as NOT ACCEPTING IT " 
Seems to me, the more I try to correct it, the more tense become the dog and the less he sits

any help is appreciated, I acquired this high drive dog WITH THE PROBLEM and I sure wish to find an effective way to fix it

thank you

p.l.d.

 I went through that same thing and i had to take some steps backwards. I stop putting so much pressure and treated the dog like a puppy. i did not expect speed or anything just simply that the dog put his but on the ground and then i used food to reward so that the dog would not get excited like he does for the ball. after that step i built the drive for the sit by using the ball and making it a game. I would let him chase the ball 2 times while it was in my hand and on the third time i would say sit while he was still in the air. the faster he sat the faster he got the reward from me. that worked well until he started to anticipate the sit so i had to change the game a little. then he got smarter and that led me to the e-collar on the butt. At first i had to use a leash as well as the e-collar so the dog would not spin around and i used the momentary button not the other just like a leash correction but on the butt. Good luck i know its frustrating but take it slow because it took me a long time due to the pressure i created for the sit to get him back to excepting the command as just another command.