Things that make you go Hmmmmmmmmmm - Page 2

getarealdog said Forgot to add, Look at the info on Nero. It says "imp" from belgium why the imp in quotes? It has his NHSB # and then his LOSH (belgian registration number below)it. SIMPLE this shows that it is in origin a belgium dog with his belgium reg.nr later imported to holland , and registered under the NHSB dutch reg.nr dont you get an AKC registration on your importdog after imported to the US that doesnot take away he also has a reg.nr in his country of origin

LOL Get, it's all hogwash they tell ya. Knowbody mixes the lines. Why would a "real" breeder do such a thing?

Duke you have helped me with some my points...... Nero is a Belgian import. Correct me if I am wrong but isn't the Antwerpa kennel in Belgium? I'm not being a smart ass I really don't know so if I am wrong tell me. So we have a large Malinios with a GSD tail with the name Antwerpa who was imported into Holland. Is there a Malinos kennel in Belgium with the name Antwerpa? I have never heard of it. So how does a Malinios with the kennel name Antwerpa have a LOSH number? The dog was about the same age as Orry. Doesn't N come right before O? Quote: "there is no such thing as a KNPV pedigree , so your conclusion about dogs changing pedigrees".... "the bloedlijnen page is setup to keep up registration of lines , as most of these dogs dont have a pedigree" Isn't a pedigree a registration of lines? What is the difference between a KNPV "pedigree" a NVBK "pedigree" and an FCI "pedigree"? They are all pedigrees. One is just recognized as a "real" pedigree So getting back to old Nero......... It looks to me as though the Antwerpa kennel bred to Arco. Nero's daddy is Arco PDT. Arco is a large dog with tan legs and a dark back. PDT dogs are known to be high drive and sharp. Arco was one of the top producing studs of Holland. Many, many KNPV dogs are line bred on him. If Arco's daddy is Othar, one of the greatest Malinios of all time, isn't that a very likely scenario? It would be a very smart one. Now if you did do that breeding, what would you do with the dogs that came out Malinios? You cull the shitters and send the good ones back to Holland (probably the breeder who's stud dog you used) where they don't care. Nero must have been a pretty good dog as he was PH1.

The Belgian kennel Antverpa (the Antwerpa is a mispelling) breeds both Malinois and GSds under the same kennel name. I was told, the husband does the GSDs and the wife does the Malinois. As to if they mix the breeds or not, who knows :) The rumors say yes. The facts??? I don't know. molly

Now I would like to explore something else. Go back to Nero and click on the image that looks like three pieces of paper next to his name. Now click on the first two dogs from the bottom. What are they? They are Tervs. IPO3 Tervs. Where did the coats come from? I don't see any Tervs in these pedigrees at all. Could be a throwback to long ago with some cross between a Malinios and a Terv, or it could be coat be coming from a GSD. Back to the theory of Antwerpa breeding Nero. If Nero looked Mal, throws dogs that look Mal, and also throws coat, all the more reason to send him back to Holland. Ok now we have Nero who throws coats and produces "Tervs". If you are a Belgian Tervuern breeder (who have gone to shit in the work) and want to improve the working ability in your dogs, wouldn't it be smart to breed to Nero, who has produced two IPO 3 Tervs? So now we have GSD's, Mals, and Tervs, all mixed up. What did that do? Antwerpa kennel is one of the best working GSD kennel. Nero went PH1 and produced many working dogs, including Tervs. I am sure Nero was bred to some Tervs as well as the Tervs he produced, improving the working ability of the Tervs. Thats how it's done in Europe. That's how you breed strong, healthy working dogs.

Thank you Molly! I have been a Malinios fan for a Looooong time. I have never heard of, or seen a Malinios with the kennel name Antverpa, ever until I found Nero. Doesn't mean they are not out there but I have seen the name in Belgian or French ring. Where do these dogs go? They go to Holland and assume a new identity.

In Europe I believe the Mals and the Tervs can share pedigrees - they are the same breed? I'm no expert but I believe this is true.

Oh, I am sure some of them end up in the NVBK too.

Tervs and Mals are the same breed, different varieties in Europe. Mixing those is not a problem, at least not that I know of. I think the AKC is the one that seperated the four varieties - which is why you might end up with an imported dog that has an FCI pedigree that is a mal...or a terv...or a groen...but has a parent, or grandparents that is one of the other three. At least that is how I understood it. ~Cate

Molly, Kind of. It used to be they were all looked at as the same breed with different coats. Mals, Tervs, Gronendals, and Lakenios. Then the "governing bodies" AKC/FCI decided the should be seperate breeds and have established "standards". Once that happened, the Mals are the only ones that kept the working ability. The Tervs and Gronendals have nice pretty coats, so the showlines took over. The work went to shit. I think the Gronendaels are one of the prettiest dogs on earth. If they worked like they used to I would own them over Mals. But I digress.... Back to your question, each country is a little different in how they do this. I am not sure what country does what but some of them allow it under special circumstances with guidlines. Like the SV and inbreeding. Others just let you register the dog either way, depending on the coat. You can register pups from the same breeding as either Terv or Mal, depending on the coat.