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by 2Cats on 22 May 2018 - 10:05

I was wondering if anyone who Imports a dog or puppy actually does tests..DNA test to support who is really the parents, and also for older dogs...do they redo the hips x rays and send to OFA?? And breeders who Import pregnant females, do you test to see if she (is who they state) and the "sire" is actually the father of the pups?

Almost 70% of all the dogs Imported is not from the parents who the seller says it is...
Almost 90% of all the dogs imported does not have the HIP rating stated on the papers or the titles...

When we wanted to Import a Female from Europe...Beautiful dog, 3 years old..We wanted to know hip ratings, titles...
Well here is the truth...She has...E1 or E2 FCI - Severe Hip Dysplasia, NO training BUT has a V show rating..
So we said No, we do not want her, Their reply was this" For $300 we change the X rays at SV to A2 (we pay the doctor to send other females x rays) and for another $300 per title we can make IPO, KKl"
This was 1 of 10 dogs that they (Multiple kennels) offered the same, any dog's hips and titles can be changed for the right money or if they are strapped for cash and need to sell dogs fast...
We did report it o FCI and SV but they cant give me an answer as what they are doing about it...

So if this is how German Shepherds are being "used" for sales, the breed is dying, and why is SV not making sure that the dogs submitted is not fake?
How do you know if the puppy you are buying here from import dogs, Parents actually have what their papers state?
I have noticed that almost all Breeders lately have FCI rated dogs...which I now see as fake dogs...They may be the things stated on their papers..but they may not..

by joanro on 22 May 2018 - 11:05

Not surprising.

Even with AKC, the registration papers are only as good as the person submitting them.

Two weeks ago, I looked at a beautiful black male, 1 1/2 year old for sale on this site.
The dog is in Czech rep, I emailed the seller for info. I asked for hip exrays. They sent them promptly. I was disappointed in what they revealed, but to be certain, I sent them to my veterinarian for his opinion. He said looks like mild hip dysplasia to him. I agreed.
I emailed the seller and asked if they could have his hips certified before I buy him. She promptly replied, 'No, his hips are not good enough for us to breed to him.'
I thanked her for her honesty and moved on.

It all depends on the individual's integrity when doing any business regarding living animals.

by duke1965 on 22 May 2018 - 11:05

interesting, can you back up your claims that 70% have incorrect parents on pedigree ,

sure there are frauds in every country but the numbers you say are really unrealistic,

also you cannot change xrays once done and for sure you cannot get IPO title for 300 dollars,

DNA is required in most european countries to get pedigrees on the pups, so your whole rant sounds a little unrealistic

by duke1965 on 22 May 2018 - 11:05

Joan, you know Czech breeders cannot breed without certified hips, problem these days with internet that every Tom Dick and Harry is trying to be a dogseller and make a buck, and many clients think it is smarter and/or cheaper, to go to the individuals themselves, wish them good luck

I have seen crap dogs offered to me for dreamprice, being sold for double that dreamprice after I refused them, the nice pedigree and heelingclip will do the magic Wink Smile


by joanro on 22 May 2018 - 11:05

Duke, my point in asking for certification was to see what she would answer. Yes, I do know they can't breed without certified hips. And there was no video of heeling with this dog that was special. What attracted me was his structure and mostly his pedigree. After I was sent videos of his bite work training as a pup, it was obvious to me where the hip problems originated....in the same room, small puppies being trained the same way. Too much altitude drops onto concrete floor repeatedly during session for a developing pups.
They did offer me a 'breeding hips quality dog'...heeling video, bite work. But his pedigree was not what I wanted...plus he was named after a communist leader.

by joanro on 22 May 2018 - 11:05

Duke: also you cannot change xrays once done and for sure you cannot get IPO title for 300 dollars,

 

Maybe not for 300 but probly for 500. And no, exrays can't be changed once done, but a 'ringer' gets used and the buyer is duped. It's easier with digital exrays to alter the name after the fact...OFA told me they require the veterinarian to personally submit digitals because of computer altering/fraud done by some owners.

 

it's not foolproof that DNA a pup means that pup can't be put into a different litter and sold with different papers. Unless there is a way to verify the DNA with the parents from country of origen, the DNA proves nothing. Unless the veterianian is doing the swabbing, fraud is easy.

It's all about money....draws out the worst in some people. That's why I was encouraged by the seller who told me they could not certify the young male's hips because they would not pass. I would trust to buy from them if they had a dog I wanted.

( I found a dog here in the US, had to drive 1600 miles, round trip, to get him because airlines would not ship because of the heat)

by 2Cats on 22 May 2018 - 12:05

Everything can be bought, when I asked how they can change the hips and titles, he said they pay the judges and vet $300 per xray and per title...the judges mark the dog as passed ipo, as long as the dog is older than 18 months... hips can be changed as long as the final hip xray has not been submitted to SV...they take x rays from good dog's hips, slap the bad dogs name and number on it, submit to SV as final hip x ray and voila!!

I was horrified...but if this is what they are doing...how many dogs is being born from"good" hip parents...they are flooding the breeding stock with terrible hips and fake titles..

 

I was just wondering if anyone actually test the dog when it gets here? redo hips and send to OFA? do dna to make sure it is the dog you bought?

by joanro on 22 May 2018 - 12:05

Papers are only as good as the person submitting them.

by joanro on 22 May 2018 - 12:05

What's with ads in the middle of our posts!!?

by duke1965 on 22 May 2018 - 13:05

2cats, judges dont do xrays and titles cannot be just written, they need to be registered from the trail they went to, but go ahead, believe all the BS, it doesnot surprise me anymore for a title in Germany you have to pay around 2500 euro, give dog and papers and get it back after it went to trail(or not)

300 euro gets you an icecream


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