Thoughts on this pedigree please - Page 1

Hi, would appreciate thoughts on this pedigree. Am i likely to get a good solid working dog from this pedigree. Have done some research and have found a few comments regarding handler aggression, apparently bought through the lines by Pike von der schafbachmuhle, any thoughts on this??

http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/german_shepherd_dog/dog.html?id=667727


ETA  not interested in debates on the colour as dog will not be used for breeding, just want information on the pedigree please.

 

 

 

Looks like an awesome working pedigree!! Although, it's a little too closely line bred for me. The dog looks old enough for you to be able to know if handler aggression is a problem? Leave it to Pike to produce even more color variances! lol I believe it was him or his line that sired the first Pandas?  Pretty interesting....
Debby

Ditsy is not a dog I would do a 2-2 breeding on......too many extremes may be produced. But that's just one opinion. He's a dog that I don't mind seeing in a pedigree for certain strengths, but I would want to balance them out on the other side. But 2-2 just not my taste.

TrIed to edit Ditsy to ditsy but having problems

Wow Djc, this is the first I hear that Pike's line is where some of those "rare" colors came from...
Do you have links to the soruce of where this info comes from.  Since Pike is in one of our lines, I would love to learn more about it.  Please share it if you have it or know where we can find it. 

Thanks!

Gustav, what extremes are you referring to? Drive? Aggression? Strange colours lol!

djc, it's the first I've heard of Pike producing colors as well. I too, have a Pike boy and looking at doing a line breeding on the P litter next year,
would love to know where the info came from also :)

Thank you!

Melissa

As far as weird colors from Pike -- no and yes. The first Panda Shepherd was a Pike grand-daughter (http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/german_shepherd_dog/dog.html?id=542954), but it was a mutation, not a gene the Pike son carried. One way we know it's a mutation is that the panda coloration is dominant and passes down in a dominant fashion (a parent has to have it/show it in order for an offspring to get it). In this case, we don't know where the liver coloration comes from--Dasty's mother line or sire line are both a possibility.



Dasty is not a dog I would do a 2-2 breeding on......too many extremes may be produced. But that's just one opinion. He's a dog that I don't mind seeing in a pedigree for certain strengths, but I would want to balance them out on the other side. But 2-2 just not my taste.

I agree with Gustav on this. I like the dogs, but it's not a combination I'd be a fan of. Extreme + extreme. I have a 12 month old who is 3-3 on Pike/Pollux and she's fantastic, so it's not even the linebreeding on Pike that concerns me--it's going through Dasty and although he was an excellent dog, he was very strong and very high drive and the other dogs behind him are also very strong. The dogs that Dasty was bred to on both top and bottom also have very high drive bloodlines. The handler aggression I had heard of coming from Pike was more along the lines of OCD and craziness than dogs who were dominant aggressive or resentful of corrections.

That said, if the dog you're looking at is already an adult, go meet him--your evaluation of him is far more relevant than any evaluation of his pedigree--which is only predictive of likelihoods. The dog at hand is going to give you the most possible information, especially if you are not looking at him for breeding.

Christine

How can the idea of Pike being the producer be attributed  to him unless he has produced it with several different females several times?  Actually we have two girls here with Pike in there pedigree.  One girl has pike in her 3rd generation. Thats pretty close up, so I definitely need to know about that color issues.  I don't want any panda GSDs if I can help it.

Way too much linebreeding too close for me, but that's just my opinion. I agree that if there was handler aggression in the dog that he's old enough to show it.