White spots on so many pups? - Page 1

Lately, while browsing through the ads, I have noticed that more and more pups are popping up with white spots.From what I understand (and correct me if I'm wrong) these white spots usually disappear as the pup gets older or sometimes changes to a very light tan.What is the reason for this happening more frequently in litters today?I have also noticed (and again, correct me if I'm wrong) that is is more apparent in working lines.

Not all white spots disappear. They are partially the result of luck, and partially the result of ignoring the warning signs such as receeding pigment, pink on the toes, white toe nails, etc.

Lots of showline puppies have white spots on chests and toes....

So are the white spots something bad? Whether they go away or not?

Ladywolf, on a different thread the other day we were discussing sable dogs and the discussion eventually contained Q & A on pigment strength, etc. It was Preston who provided a lot more insight into pigment strength issues as far as qualification/disqualification of dogs per the breed standard. Are the white spots more common than they once were? I can't say, because I don't see that many puppies. However nowadays I do notice many show-line adults who display a tremendous amount of white beside the withers and on the rear pants. And that is both the Ambred show-line and the West German show-line. How they make it so far with this much white present is hard for me to understand. The standard does allow for a very small amount to be present. Often a puppy with decent pigment will be born with a small white diamond-shaped patch on the brisket, and typically this goes away by the time the puppy is two (2) years old. Less often, a puppy is born with one (1) pale toe pad on one (1) foot, and these tend to disappear after the puppy is a few months old. At least that is my experience with them with the puppies that we had. However I think that once a breeder starts seeing many of these small clues then a determination must be made by him of how he intends to improve the pigment. Especially if he starts seeing pale toenails and a fading mask. Bob-O

I have seen two litters in the best year (working lines) where at least one pup or more have a bit of white on their toes. However, in no way did they lack pigmentation throughout the rest of their coat... just a bitsy bit on their toes. I had seen the parents for both litters and did not notice white on any of their toes... not that I looked closely. So, with this knowledge, I would assume there is a recessive gene in the gene pool causing this look... but the bit I have seen is exclusive to the tips of the toes. I have seen plenty of adults with a little white underneath or on their chest, but I don't think that has anything to do with the toes.

Many black and dark colored working dogs have a small amount of white on their chest. From my experience small amounts of white on a pups foot may go away but usually if you look close after they mature they still have the white hairs but harder to see. Years ago my best female had a small amt of white on her chest and I made sure the male I bred her too had none. Had seven pups and only two had small white spot on their chest. I kept one of them because IMO she was the best pup of the litter. She is a black sable with a thick rich coat and all her nails and pads were black.

This was posted on a gsd site Common Dominant White Spotting Gene The dominant white spotting gene found in nearly all mammals is common in the German Shepherd Dog. It is independent of the genes for the coat color and marking patterns in the breed. The most common sites for dominant white spotting include the tip of the tail, the chest, and the toes. It does NOT indicate anything as to whether a dog carries recessive white. It does NOT indicate whether a dog carries genes for rich or paled colors or dilutions. VERY RARE Irish White Spotting Gene A second white spotting gene occurs rarely in the German Shepherd Dog, that responsible for markings known as "Irish white spotting." This gene causes white spotting to appear on the muzzle, forehead, chest, belly, feet, and tail tip, such as found in Collies, Shelties, and a number of other breeds. This gene, in cases I have studied, is recessive. Pups with such markings usually come from parents who do not themselves have the markings. It is likely that dogs with such markings would not produce them unless bred back into a line that has produced these markings. I only have data on a few cases of this type of white spotting, and would welcome much more photo and pedigree data to deepen my knowledge of it. Like the dominant white spotting gene, this one is also independent of the dog's coat color and pattern genes.

Johnsk9, is this "VERY RARE Irish White Spotting Gene" similar to, or the cause of the coloration of the panda shepherds?

Johnsk9, excellent, interesting post. I enjoyed reading it. Interestingly enough, two (2) of my living dogs have a cross between an all-white ancestor to an all-black ancestor about nine (9) generations ago (Gee, only in the A.K.C.-it's a wonder they were not siblings). But they have the typical tan/black markings with a bit of sable, and one has especially heavy pigmentation whereas his ears are "stained" inside and his scrotum's skin is nearly black. While their dam had the "white star" on her brisket as a puppy, she lost it by the age of two (2) years. Their other siblings seemed to have decent pigment to the end that a few of them had blue/black spots on their tongues. Only one of their siblings (different litter) had a light toe pad, but this disappeared about the same time the puppy was sold. Bob-O Bob-O