Should SV allow registrations from foreign countri - Page 3

With all that said , in light of all the liberals, green party, PETA, etc etc. I don't see Schutzhund as we know it to be around in 10 years, or if it is it will be so watered down that there will be no more bitework or stick hits. So all this yak about SV, AKC, WDA, UScA isn't gonna matter anyway. So lets go out and train some dogs LOL

Frank, I was not saying that people had to be a USA member to trial. Maybe I was not clear in how I responded above. But to show a dog in conformation, what I wrote was correct. Our region pays much more than your region does for regional dues. USA dues are the same. I am curious where you are. As far as membership, we have two regional clubs currently, perhaps three, that are defunct, yet still listed as member clubs on the USA website. I wonder if that is unique to our region and many clubs carry people who really are not active. While it may be true that as a whole that USA has more trials, more members etc. than WDA and DVG, I am not sure it can be said we have the best helper program. After all, DVG has had one going for several years. And in our area, the DVG clubs do hold many events. But that is not the point. The point is that perhaps you live in an area that is blessed with lots of clubs, lots of activities, and lots of helpers. But some of us do not. And the organization does nothing to help that. There are many clubs that do not have helpers. It is very difficult to continue without a helper. The breed registry is a joke and that comes from people who really pushed for it. It is worthless and a waste of energy, staff and volunteer time and money we do not have to waste. Duplication is a waste, period. And no, we will never get the AKC out of being the official registry for the country. But my point is that we MIGHT be able to effect the AKC through the GSDCA-WSA. I said MIGHT. It too may be hopeless. I do agree with Uwe that in a few years SchH will probably not be what we see now, and if it even exists (except on the fringes), personally I will be surprised. Why? Again, because none of the organizations, including USA is doing what it takes to ensure survival and part of what it takes is all of us somehow joining together and seeking common goals. But that is probably never going to happen in my lifetime.... As well, frankly, many people are simply not interested in putting in the time and effort to train their dogs. We all have probably seen that often when people say they want to do it, but after seeing what is involved, drop out. So yes, for the moment, I go out and have fun training my dogs.

"And just for your information, the AKC is NOT affiliated with the FCI" AKC IS recognized as the ONLY breed registry from the United States by the FCI. The WUSV can tell USCA that they can no longer send a team because they are not affiliated with the AKC. THose with short memories USCA was on the sh*t list with the SV a couple years ago. USCA said they would not accept titles from SV judges obtained from other organizations (GSDCA-WDA). The fatalistic attitude of some is amazing. Things can be changed anywhere, anytime under the right direction. What is the GSDCA going to do if 5 or more SV breed surveyed working dogs begin showing up at all of their shows? What if the the WDA began doing demonstrations at the same shows? The United States of America was built on revolution. You will always have those neh sayers. But they would rather talk about what can't be done. As opposed to trying to get something done. Kyle

"As well, frankly, many people are simply not interested in putting in the time and effort to train their dogs. We all have probably seen that often when people say they want to do it, but after seeing what is involved, drop out." Disagree big time. I think the statement should read "As well, frankly, many people are simply not interested in putting in the time and effort to train their dogs IN SCHUTZHUND. We all have probably seen that often when people say they want to do it, but after seeing what is involved IN DEALING WITH THE PETTINESS, EGOS, ABUSE, AND LACK OF SUPPORT FOR NEWBIES, drop out." If I buy a pup and visit a Schutzhund club and the first thing I hear is "oh, you bought from THAT breeder???" or "oh, those bloodlines will never work", and then get to watch people yell and swear at each other on the field for hours, maybe some rough training methods, and am then told that I shouldn't do anything with my pup until he is older because it will ruin him if he is mannered......why would I stay in the sport? Where is the fun in that? I'm being extreme to make a point, not all clubs are like this, but it happens too often, and drives more people away than anyone wants to stop and think about. If something is fun, people will put any amount of time into it. If it's drudgery, you're lost and need help (but don't get it), and you don't enjoy getting yelled at every week.....you'll move on. Ever hear that saying "if you love what you do, it's never work"? Agility junkies spend every bit as much time training as Schutzhund addicts, and they spend every weekend at agility trials. There are plenty of people that do AKC events and have titles on the same dog in tracking, obedience, agility and now rally. Say what you want about the difficulty of those venues, but the point is, those people are putting in TIME in multiple venues to attain their titles. Lots of time. So, I don't think we lose people because of the time required in Schutzhund. I think we lose people because this tends to be a highly negative, critical group of people who aren't the most welcoming bunch to "outsiders" (new people are usually OK if they are your own client with your breeding, or at least have a bloodline that you like)

LaPorte, That post was on the mark and just think, only 25 years ago in the USA if you said "Shutzhund", no one had a clue as to what you were talking about. I find the Germans are more "user friendly" towards newbies(having lived there 5 years and repeated visits over the years). I have always been made to feel welcome(since 1982) regardless of the club or venue.

LaPort, I highly agree with what you said. I wasn't willing to jump right into Shcutzhund when I bought my first titled dog. I wanted to come out and just hang out and see what it would entail. Time, money, and attitudes, before I commited to the club. They were not ok with that and want only serious competitors in their club. I wasn't willing to call myself serious or promise my elligience, so I quickly lost interest with no support. I wanted more of a hobby, fun activity with my dogs that I could participate in when my schedule allowed. The personal protection was my main interest, so I looked into PSA. Much friendlier and more flexible. If I can only make it out once a month, they are ok with that. I don't have to be on a schedule to win titles for their club. Schutzhund left a bad taste in my mouth. I'll never go back, altho I do still love to watch and support others who compete in it. Too much worrying about bloodlines and who bred the dog rather than just working the dog. Stupid, stupid, stupid, and such a shame.

LaPorte, I too agree with much you say and what you share was in large measure my experience when I began Schutzhund 7 or 8 years ago. Because I have a disability, I was told early on by one club that I could not participate. Because the dog I had at the time is half American and show lines, I was told he could not do it, simply because of his bloodlines and looks, without any kind of testing or allowing us to try. I was told how "shitty" my dogs were once I bought a second dog and came back. Both dogs by the way are now titled, one to SchH 2 and one to SchH 3. The bottom line is that I really wanted to do Schutzhund and I trained and learned alone for a long time. When I could afford it and find someone, I hired people to help me privately. And there was one woman who did spend many hours helping me out of the goodness of her heart. When I felt I knew enough about the rules etc. to have my own club, I started one. I wanted to be a different kind of club and I think we are. Continued:

Our club is not like what you or I describe and there are other clubs who are open and welcome new people. Sometimes onne just has to keep looking, and if you can not find a good fit, start your own club. Our club is not into politics and BS. We simply want people who want to train and to have fun with their dog. But we will not allow people do only do bitework, and sometimes that is what people want to do. On the other hand, as the leader of the club, I can tell you that over the years I have seen plenty of people come to our club and waste our time. Some really were not disciplined enough to make the commitment. I cannot begin to count the hours I have spent on the phone talking to people about the sport and GSDs, only to have no follow-up on the other end from that person. So I have some sympathy for some clubs who have grown tired of wasting time with people who are not serious. A case in point: recently a man called and said he was interested. But after speaking to him more than 45 minutes, he then told me he was also interested in SAR. In my area, his chances of getting into an SAR group with no experience is slim. Lots of people think they want to do that too, but are unwilling to follow through even if some group will take them. Or they really do not have a dog who can do it. As well, most SAR groups in our area will not take dogs involved in Schutzhund. Most have a poor understanding of the sport and many misconceptions. So in the end with this man, I told him to look into SAR and if he wanted to follow through with Schutzhund after finding out more about that, to call me back. He never has. Of course, there are clubs in our area that will not take someone new unless they think their dog is "right", from the right bloodlines *(that means working bloodlines only) or who express a desire to be a national level competitor. We have show lines, working bloodlines and even Rotties in our club and welcome anyone with any dog! We feel that if all a dog learns is socialization skills, or basic obedience, the dog and owner will be better off. We are a different club in that we want people who want to learn. But we do not want to waste time with people who are not serious about participating. We do not require people to be "serious" competitors, only that they train regularly and commit time and energy on their own to do so besides weekly club meetings. We also expect members to support our activities. So with work schedules, kids, school, etc., we often have people who want to do it, but who do not have the time. Continued:

As a boarding kennel owner who also offers obedience training, I also can tell you that I have almost stopped doing obedience training without payment up front for at least 10 sessions. Why? Because all too often people find too many other things to do and too many excuses not to follow through. Good training takes a long, long time. More often than not it is the owner who needs the training first. People want quick fixes and that is why as a teacher I have also seen problems holding kids in activities like sports, music, debate clubs etc. We want immediate results often and Schutzhund is not that type of activity. Finally, I am sorry you have not had good experiences. There are some good clubs and good people involved, in all the organizations. You just have to find them. Keep on trying. In the right group, it sure is a lot of fun. Good luck.

Hodie, where are you located? Your club sounds like the PSA club here. They have Bull breeds, GSD's, a Rottie, a Dobie, Mals and even Presa's. I like their openess to everyone. No they do not want their time wasted either but if we as the owner of the dog, are happy with the progress, they will keep teaching. If I were to join a Sch club, of course I would do the OB and tracking. OB is required in PSA as well. Some teasing is always put on you, if you miss a few trainings but nothing bad. Some of the memebers drive very far to train, for a couple hours and then have to work the next day. Saturdays are ALL DAY sessions. In my area the clubs are "full" unless you have something they want. Then suddenly there is a spot available. I just can't drive 2 1/2 hrs one way to the next Sch club. I'd love to train privatly and do. My bf/trainer doesn't know much about Sch though. PSA, Mondio, and the other Ringsports are what we focus on. It's all in fun for me. I could care less if I get a title or not. That could change in the future. Depends how nice my next pup turns out. He on the other hand, plans to make it to the Nationals again. I'll do all I can to see he makes it there. If that means me and my dog take the back burner, that's ok with me.