Should SV allow registrations from foreign countri - Page 2

Pepdog and Hodie You 2 are insane if you think that the 500 members of the GSDCA-WDA are going to change anything over the many 1000's of members the GSDCA has. Hodie you say "I personally have great dislike of the AKC, for many reasons, including their lack of ethics and standards" But joining the GSDCA-WDA is SUPPORTING the AKC, IT is a part of the AKC.... Working Enthusiast will NEVER get anything done with the GSDCA..They are out numbered 1000 to 1...... Frank

Frank, I am not insane, if you have personal reasons for disliking the AKC ,I respect that. This is only my opinion on the subject. I'm a member of WDA an I support that. Joe

Joe You said "We need improve in breeding program and through GSDCA-WDA I hope we can achieve our goals as breeders and trainers" My point was your insane if you think that the 400 or 500 members of GSDCA-WDA can change what the GSDCA is doing. The GSDCA is the one that changed the breed standard from the FCI and SV standard. The GSDCA IS the AKC and with them NOTHING will change. Too much money from Covy Tucker Hills and breeders like that. If I thought for a minute that the WDA could do anything to fix the breeding in this country, I would join. But they have changed more rules and Regulations from the SV/VDH than USA has. Just my opinion Frank

Unknown (Frank), The AKC is presently worthless in my opinion as I already stated. So Frank (Unknown) I would be interested in hearing your solution/s to the many problems we all face. I do not disagree that to date GSDCA-WDA has done little to make a difference. However, my point was that United Schutzhund Clubs of America has also done nothing and more importantly, is using membership funds to do things that do not help the bottom line. The organization is about a few members and wastes it efforts and energy duplicating and trying to compete with all the other organizations, rather than working to unify and build a strong organization. This is probably also true of the WDA, although I am not a member. But at the very least, at this point, the GSDCA does have a member on the FCI board and that is a start if organizations could talk to each other. The sad fact is that none of the organizations will work together for a common goal. In fact, the organizations, and their members, can not agree on any common goals. You are probably correct that there are many more GSDCA members breeding American conformation dogs, with little interest in the working abilities of the breed, but there are a lot of Schutzhund and breed enthusiasts that could make a difference if we were in a single organization rather than splitting our numbers as we do. Of course, when officers of organizations can not even communicate between each other, there is not much hope any common goals or common organization will result. Cledford, to participate in United Schutzhund Clubs trial, your dog must only have a scorebook and that is only $10. To participate in a conformation show, at 12 months of age or more, yes, the dog must be registered with the organization and that costs a lot more. As you know, membership dues and club dues are required with all clubs also having to pay regional and organizational dues. We get nothing for it and in my region, pay more than $200 a year. Frank, if you disagree, fine. But I won't tell you that you are insane.......

Frank, Yes, I said that and I also said that "I HOPE" wishful thinking. Sorry, if I offended some very loyal members of USCA, I was a member also, if you want you can ask my good friend Johannes Grewe who's a judge for USCA.....Joe

Just thought I'd chime in, considering I've actually done this several times with perfect success. So, I'm not speaking from something I've heard, but actually something I've done! Any dog with AKC registration can still do everything in Germany that a dog with SV Pink Papers can do... there are certain specific steps that must be taken, i.e. DNA testing on both parents on file with the SV, a 4 generation pedigree from the AKC, Hip/Elbow certification from the SV, and a scorebook issued by the VDH/DVG/SV, etc. And just for your information, the AKC is NOT affiliated with the FCI. If anyone wants detailed step by step instructions let me know. David

Hodie My point was just that the GSDCA-WDA will get nothing changed. USA will not either in the AKC, but at least if I support USA, we are a organization that is for the GSD. You say you get nothing for your dues. Well, I'm sorry that your region is like that, In my region I can trial my dog on almost every weekend at a USA event between May-Nov. I compete at regional, national and club events. I can show and Koer my dogs. I don't know where you got your information, but you do not have to be a member of a club to compete and show. $60 per year membership fee and a 1 time Registartion fee of $35 for USA registration. I don't know where you came up with all that expense. My club pays $150 per year to USA for Regional AND USA membership, but that is devided between 14 members, so add about another $12 per member, to me that is a total expense to USA of $72 per YEAR.. Plus you get the bi-monthly magazine. Not a bad deal if you ask me. Clubs dues are set by the club and the amount is up to the club (same as in WDA) so you can't hold that against USA. I'm sorry you had a bad experience with USA but there is no way I am sending in money to support GSDCA-WDA which is connected to GSDCA which is connected to AKC which is the root of all evil in the GSD in America. Frank

I didn't mean to turn this into a USA-GSDCA-WDA pro-con debate. I probably should have been clearer in my first post when I referred to the hypothetical organization as SV-USA. I was thinking United States of America NOT United Schutzhund.... I agree that the AKC is worthless. I also agree that the GSDCA has done more damage than good in promoting the interests of the breed. The only reason the WDA was formed was because they were worried about the hundreds of members leaving to join other organizations (money). The AKC only agreed to their recent changes regarding working dog trials because they are also worried about members flocking to these other organizations. So, I ask again: What is tying us to the AKC? Why not get rid of them? Why can't a new organization be started to eventually replace them?? If, as David says, the AKC is not even affiliated with the FCI then why could'nt the SV be made to recognize a new organization-at first in addition to the AKC and eventually in place of the AKC. These are not argumentative questions, I just really want to know. Why do we tolerate the AKC monopoly??

If you want true "SV" papers. get your dog from Germany. SV doesn't have to register anything from outside Germany, unless it wants to for the benefit of the $$$. SV is not say all know all of German Shepherd dog, maybe many years ago when emphasis and care was directed toward the GSD rather than the mighty $$$. USA/SV papers is recognized at .....Ah yea USA events only, not recognized by AKC, SV etc. Just as the WDA is starting their SV registry it will be as worthless as USA papers. This is OLD news. As much as we dispise the AKC it is THE recognized Breed registry for the United states, period. Neither 4500 UScA membership or a 400 WDA membership is going to take any Breed registrations away from the multi million dollar Corporate AKC. As far as Breed registry and bettering the breed I understand UScA trying to diligently following the SV standard and WDA well ???, and GSDCA and AKC ...well they have their own standard. SV has been around 100 years and AKC about the same, USA + WDA been around barely 30yrs and their registries will continue to be only recognized inside their own organizations.

<<<>>> UScA has the largest list of certified helpers in this country, far exceeding both WDA AND DVG list of certified helpers. UScA membership has always fluctuated and averages about 4500+ members so nothing is dwindling at all. UScA has a list of clubs that far exceeds the number of clubs WDA AND DVG has. UScA has trials every years that far exceeds the number of trials by both WDA AND DVG. USA is stillTHE premier Schutzhund organization in this country. With the best Helper Certification program, Judge apprentiship programs, Breed Registry, that is just now in the last couple years being copied by WDA. In the end any connection with AKC, working dog program and WDA will always be under the short leash of AKC, because the WDA 400+ members that are involved with SchH have to realize that the majority of the ers of GSDCA DO NOT want anything to do with Schutzhund and the rest of the 1000's of members of AKC DO NOT want anything to do with Schutzhund. So whether the WDA has a member on the WUSV board now (and congratulation to him) it is not going to change anything UNLESS WDA breaks away from AKC's short leash, which they never can do.