Sieger only 2 times? - Page 1

I have seen that till now a dog has been awarded a sieger title maximum twice(Uran,Rikkor,Yasko,Larus, Fanto). Whereas dogs have won VA title as many as 4 to 5 times ( Timo,Zamb,Jango,etc). Is there a rule as to dog can become sieger only twice or is it unwritten understanding that dog retires from show career after that?

Sorry Jango was not 4 times but there are other dogs like Karly Arminius,etc.

Politics and money are a major consideration.

That may be the case but then why in so many years no dog has become 3 times sieger.

Well a very interesting topic! Couldn't keep away! Even i used to often wonder why not a triple sieger ?? Yasko could've done it! But politics is one of the major reasons!

I dont understand what politics got to do with it. If a person can make a dog sieger twice with influence and politics then why not such a powerful person make it thrice. I think it is just a mutual understanding of all the top breeders and judges ( I mean the top people).

I had a breeding with VA1 Larus Von Batu 6 weeks before he was sold to China(at that point the owner said he would not sell Larus at ANY price), and I asked the owner was Larus going to be in the 2006 Sieger show(Larus was only 5 years old at the time). Herr Herzing look at me in a very perplexing fashion and asked me, "Why?" So just maybe the mind set is that there is nothing else to really accomplish after winning the crown twice. Just an opinion. Stephen

Dear Stephen, Thank you for sharing your experience. Yes there is nothing to achieve once the dog is twice sieger. But I mean nobody has never tried for third time just for the recoed. As Arnold Schwarzenegger had nothing to prove after winnig 6 in row Mr.Olympia but came back after 6 years to win for the 7th time. This is just a freindly discussion. I do not want to talk about politics and vested interest involved in making a sieger.

I would personally go as far, as to exclude the Sieger automatically from the next years' VA selection. A "Sieger" has proven to be the best of his race, and has nothing else to prove about his anatomy or offspring*. There are many more dogs/bloodlines (worth the title) to choose from. * = In this respect however, DO keep in mind, I would never allow any dog to take a VA selection let alone the Sieger-position, without proven progeny. (This means for instance, I would never have allowed Larus the first Sieger-title in his carreer, there was not enough progeny to subjectively prove his offspring. He deserved his title very well the second time, don't understand me wrong now! Orbit vom Hühnegrab as another example was way too young to be awarded a VA selection.) The SV-Judges have the paramount task to broaden the bloodbase. Focusing on the individual animal (see: Ursus-Yasko-Larus) is in my opinion a huge mistake.

A Sieger male is usually already a male in his prime, not like some of the younger males you see as new VAs. Can only stay in that prime for so long... Once a male hits 5 or 6 its time to make room for some newcomers to have their day in the limelight. And a younger male pushing up may just be better that given year. So from the VA1 the dog can only go down and the owner has to consider carefully if the dog can hold the VA1 title. But there is no rule that will forbid a male to go VA1 a certain number of times.