Please....anyone....I'd really appreciate feedback.... - Page 7

"And one thing....if I have all this money for my Porche and foreclosure investments, shouldn't it be evident that I have no need to make money from dogs?"

Clara,

I have never bred dogs, but I have bred horses and I imagine dogs aren't a lot different than horses. I can tell you that if you do everything right and are 100% ethical and conscientious you won't make money. You need to provide the necessary training and exhibiting (breeding stock should be "proven"), maintain a clean and healthy environment, have excellent mares, breed to worthy top notch studs, spend adequete time imprinting and training the foals, feed high quality grain, hay and supplements, give the horses proper care and handling and  have them vetted regularly, as well  when any health issue arises. If you do all of these things,  there is very little if any money to be made in horses. We lost money every year! 

I just hope that making money is not your ultimate goal.  

Char

Hello Brondos mom....
I respect you for coming on here and asking for information on getting started and doing things the right way. I do agree with your outlook on owning a dog that is not aggressive or mean all of the time. You can absolutely have a protector that is not overly aggressive at no apparent threat and it to be used only when you as the "leader" choose to tell them when it is needed. It is not your dogs choice to decide what is threat and is not threat..... what to act out against (unless it is obvious that you or your dog are being physically attacked). It is your job to train with various circumstances in mind so that you can rely on the amount of control you and your dog have together. I noticed that you said you would be breeding simply for "companion/family protectors" when you are doing that I assume you mean that your dog can reliably protect your entire family, including children. That must mean you expect a great amount of control on your dog. You have even greater expectations for them if you think that they will protect you without training and being titled to prove their abilities.

As for the GSD.... don't work with that breed myself have seen too many issues with health, temperment, etc. because of the many poor quality breeders choosing to overlook so many things. If you really want to hang in there with the owners and standard GSD's I highly recommend you do as Kelly mentioned and get involved to bring more long coats on the field. The best support you will get is to get a long coat GSD working on the field so that people will acknowledge them as "the same quality" dog and will definately come back and be a big pat on the back for you. 

If you are getting in to breeding, working, anything dogs..... people are extremely passionate about their dogs and the hardwork they have put into their own programs. I am sure most people do not try to project the image of "the know it all" or with attidude but you will soon learn it is with every handler/breeder/owner who is trying to make an example of proper ownership/breeding/ etc. of their desired breed. I for example will not even sell a dog to someone who has never owned my breed or something similar to my breed and I will not sell to pet homes..... EVER! It is not that I do not appreciate the people's interest or think that they are incapable of providing for that dog but it would be to much of a risk to me to sell a dog with the potential risk of it being too much for the handler and being sold to someone else, or put in a shelter, or fatally bites someone, is breed irresponsibly therefore resulting in a genetic crap pool for my breed, etc.

I am a newcomer into this as well.... on my way to becoming a breeder myself. I have yet to have a litter because none of my dogs are ready and I am still learning as well. You never stop!!! Anyone who says they know it all then obviously move along and talk with others. But my point is I have been working hard for what I have for about 4.5 years (and not even a breeding yet) and it always alarms me when I hear of people getting into it.... and especially as fast as you have mentioned.
Again I admire that you are trying to get on your feet the right way and I hope that you do something exceptional with the long coat. Their are many beautiful long coated breeds that are proven workers as set by their standards.... schnauzers, bouviers, black russian terriers, etc. Hope the next one can be the long coat GSD. Thanks again and hope to see you out there!! Amanda

WOW.......I think she's got the point by now.

Amanda, I have read some of your other posts and it sounds like you are doing right by the breed of your choice and have chosen to educated yourself as well as work with the breed for a number of years before breeding. Kudos. We can only hope that Clara has a moment of enlightenment and will decide to do the same thing.

There are two problems with telling her to make a mark in the GSD world by showing what a long coat to do. The first is that she has emphatically stated that she sees no need to work her dogs other than to put them to work making pet puppies for her to sell. She really has no interest in the breed or even learning about her individual dogs though training and working with them. Furthermore she lacks the most rudimentary knowledge of the breed. She thinks LC w/o an undercoat are perfectly fine and does not understand they have been DQ since day1 and it all relates to the weatherability and thus workability of the dog. Oh darn there I go using that W word again - work.

The second is the longcoat ( longstock hair with undercoat) GSD has long ago made their mark in the working world. Prior to 1968 they could achieve KKl1a status and from 1968 to I think 1999 were allowed KKl2 status. They have been WUSV competitors ( and I believe podium placers), police dogs, herding dogs, SAR and obedience dogs among other things. Many obedience competitors in this country preferred coats since it seems some of them tend to come with an extra dose of willingness. I personally  have known several including one of my own that were tremendous herding dogs showing great natural ability and talent. Even since their DG in 1999 as breeding dogs they were still allowed and do to this day to compete in working trials. So no we do not need Clara to teach us about what coats can do. We know already and there are many of us who love them. We do need Clara to learn however -learn about her own dogs, learn about the breed, learn responsibility. She could make her mark by choosing the right road as it appears you have done but unfortunately it seems she had no interest in doing that.

Here is an article that you as a budding breeder, I think will enjoy. I suspect Clara won't get it. It's called Breeder's Privilege.
http://showdogsupersite.com/kenlclub/k9journal/breeder'sprivilege.html

Edit: nevermind, must have been a hiccup with my ISP. I can access the article now.

Good article, very heartwarming.

And wow!  "Her mother was returned to me by her owner as she “couldn’t be shown and couldn’t be bred”

Hmmmm...I just found out my GSD bitch "can't be shown and can't be bred". Just had her spayed due to a mild case of dysplasia. But return her to the breeder because of that? Never crossed my mind...

Of course, if he wants to refund me the difference between breeding rights price and pet price...

Sunsilver, 
It is copyrighted so I do not feel I can do that. I did right click on the above link and it worked for me. You might also try copying the link and pasteing it to a different window. Finally I have listed a number of links from this site in this other thread on breeding questions  http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/bulletins_read/312359.html#315332  if you go the the first one listed it's an index page and the above article is listed on it with an active link.

Hope this helps.

"And one thing....if I have all this money for my Porche and foreclosure investments, shouldn't it be evident that I have no need to make money from dogs?"

There is no money in breeding the dogs, Most here do it just for the love of the dogs. Also with the economy, you can look thru this data base and see that many of the breeders are or have gotten out. They can not afford to support thier hobby any longer. Heck I know of a few of them that will give you a good dog if it is the right home, because they love them and just want them protected.
This is not the business to go into right now, the overhead will kill you. Now if you did own the proche and needed a tax wright off because of the losses you will suffer.

Long haired GSDs are a fault and should not be bred from!!

Siancov,
The AKC considers the long coat to be a fault, but in 2009 the SV voted on allowing the long coats with undercoats. It became official in the SV since the last "Bundesversammlung". The SV has decided that there is no reason to ban Long Coats with an undercoat from breeding. It was suppossed to start at the beginning of 2010 with separate rings in the shows and the Körung although I haven't heard anything recently.
They cannot be bred with standard coat dogs, so Long Coats must be bred with ONLY Long Coats.
Long Coats without the undercoat is still a fault and these dogs will not be allowed in the breeding program.
So... the times are a changin'.
Char