Max would Cry - Page 5

That was written before we had access to things we have access to today. There's nothing wrong with a "faded" dog. They could be just as healthy or unhealthy as standard colored dogs. (Not necessarily defending them, just stating a fact.)

I bet that if the standard suddenly said that livers, blues, and whites were okay to breed and show, the breeders who breed for "rare" colors will try to find something new and "unique" to breed for.

^ Exactly.

Agreed. But (pre: genetic sciences) I can quite understand why Max thought "...paling is mostly a sign of wrong breeding or overbreeding", thinking of many of the shitty examples of BYB dogs observed on the streets of the UK down the last 50-odd years !

Which is genetically MORE detrimental between this two:

Breeding for Piebald or breeding for Self Black?

I find it just a bit rich when the defenders of the standard get outraged about breeding for colour when they are in fact doing the same thing.

Its not random chance you see a sea of red and blacks at SV shows, saddle backs at AKC....

Why so many breeders get excited when they get their treasured solid blacks, bi-coliurs, reverse masks, raccoon eyed dark sables....

Ya gotta laugh.
 

The above post by vk4gsd,👏👏👏

Hmmmm....I agree to a point w/vk BUT even if not a color breeder, if you're breeding for the whole dog, choosing to add new blood only from health and temperament tested dogs, likely titled....you're just not going to have that many opportunites for colors outside the common ones adhering to the standard.

So long as breeders keep getting requests reading like "I only want a black sable male" (I got that one yesterday) and choose to cater to it instead of educate, that problem ain't goin' nowhere!

I'd say breeding for piebald, because the homozygous form of the piebald gene is lethal. Who i n their right mind is going to breed for a colour that causes half of th embryos to die in the womb?

The only way to prevent this from happening would be to breed piebald to a dog that doesn't carry the gene. And that means that not all the pups would be piebald, which of course, is going to hurt your pocketbook if you're breeding just to sell these unusual coloured dogs!

Self-black isn't lethal in the homozygous form, is it? I'm not that familiar with it.

Who in their right mind will breed Piebald to Piebald, or Harlequin to Harlequin, or Merle to Merle (some double merles do survive, though) !

So, the breeder has a heterozygous Piebald, and has the liberty to choose from ANY dog, except another heterozygous Piebald.

A Self Black breeder has a homozygous or heterozygous self black, and CANNOT choose other than homozygous or heterozygous self black.

Which option is healthier?

The working panda breeder breeds her pandas to blacks, SS.