Question: Pastern proportion

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by Hundmutter on 11 July 2012 - 18:07

Daryl - my pastern measurement started at the top of the metacarpals and ends at the first joint of those bones i.e.
like the flat bones in ones hand down to the knuckles. Counting all beyond that as toes.
I never learned Trig - spent most of my Math lessons in the school corridor ... definitely a bit 'challenged'
in that respect - ho ho.

by Hundmutter on 11 July 2012 - 18:07

I expect there are some anatomical/medical names for the parts of the metcarpals which would help distinguish
the lower bones from the upper ... but I can't find them @ present.

by susie on 11 July 2012 - 21:07

Out of :

F.C.I.-Standard-Nr. 166/23.03.1991/D

Fassung 1997

Deutscher Schäferhund.............Der Vordermittelfuß hat eine Länge von ca. 1/3 des Unterarmes und hat einen Winkel von ca. 20° bis 22° zu diesem. Sowohl ein zu schräg stehender Vordermittelfuß (mehr als 22°) als auch ein steil stehender Vordermittelfuß (weniger als 20°) beeinträchtigen die Gebrauchseignung, insbesondere die Ausdauerfähigkeit.

So it´s said "ca" - more or less 1/3 - NOT exactly.

Kind regards,
Susie

by Louis Donald on 13 July 2012 - 08:07

The current SV/FCI standard is standard No.166 dated 23/12/2010 and it is stated there under 'elbows' . An English translation may say forearm but it should be foreleg - same thing.

Louis

by Hundmutter on 13 July 2012 - 16:07

But I cannot understand while every translation of every Standard I was looking at omitted any reference to
the magic 1/3rd. {Thank you, Susie}
I say 'magic' cos there are many outside references to the same proportion, e.g. in (human) figure drawing.
I don't have the 2010 FCI version, think its in a magazine in a box somewhere in storage. Shows the age of my
book library ! (Was looking at Wootton, Elliots, Willis, Allans, Schwabacher & Grey, even Andrew Winfrow)

Linda.

by Louis Donald on 14 July 2012 - 10:07

To repeat;

The 'current' SV / FCI standard No.166 dated 23/12/2010 states; ' the pastern has a length of approximately 1/3 of the foreleg '

Louis

by Hundmutter on 15 July 2012 - 10:07

So the origin of it being included in the [current ] 2010 Standard is ???

Really don't want to derail the thread, but I am now curious - about the discussion (@ SV or @ FCI ?)
leading up to something being included, that does not appear to have been felt necessary in past years
(or at least felt unnecessary by those translating the earlier versions into English) ...

by Louis Donald on 16 July 2012 - 08:07

Nothing to do with translation errors or ommissions. I can't tell you why the SV decided to include it in their latest update of the standard but they did and it is now part of the SV and FCI standard.
What I can say is that one of my SV examiners told me to use it as a guide 30 years ago - its been accepted as guide for a very long time.

Louis

by Hundmutter on 16 July 2012 - 09:07

Well that was why I was thrown when I couldn't find reference to it in all the earlier stuff - 'cos as I said to Ibrahim we
'all' have that 'roughly a third' thing at least at the back of our minds, so it must have come from somewhere.
It seems a little unusual to just chuck something in when revising a Standard, there's usually some debate about
whether it is necessary or not, so - not having noticed a debate for the 2010 version - I'd love to catch up on what
the SV's reasoning for including this actually was. Anyone lurking on here who knows the answer ?

by Ibrahim on 17 July 2012 - 18:07

That was educating, thanks to each and every one who shared info and views, thank you so much

Ibrahim

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Question: Pastern proportion - Page 3

Pedigree Database

The 'current' SV / FCI standard No.166 dated 23/12/2010 states; ' the pastern has a length of approximately 1/3 of the foreleg '