what do you feed? - Page 3

Jyl, if you want fat and protein....look into Professional Active formula, it too is similiar to Kirklands but for some reason my dogs didn't do well with it.  30% protein, 20% fat with some glucosamine/chondroitin.

If you want fish oil, get Wholistic Salmon Oil, great quality, and your dog will only need a half a teaspoon to a teaspoon per day, great price, a half a gallon lasts 5 dogs plus some puppies several months.

I feed my adults dogs and my puppies Acana grain free Wild Prairie

ggturner, in dog food the first ingredient is over 70% water, so the second ingredient is actually first.

This does not make sense to me since the 1st ingredient is salmon "meal" and meal has less water:
http://www.examiner.com/dogs-in-denver/dog-food-101-what-is-meal-when-listed-as-an-ingredient

http://www.dogfoodadvisor.com/choosing-dog-food/about-meat-meal/

http://www.dogfoodproject.com/index.php?page=betterproducts

I feed Lukas TOTW (the duck formula) He does better on that then any of the others, they give him the runs. He has allergies but they only come in the summer.

I put Jaxon on Wellness LB Puppy and fell in love. Firm stool. Great Coat. So we put the other adult we have on Wellness as well.

von Harasymtzuk,  do you have a degree in animal nutrition?  Not trying to criticize, just confused about your comment about water content.  I get my advice from Dr. Susan Lauten (http://www.petnutritionconsulting.com/index.htm).  Here is what she has to say on "meal":  

"In dry kibble foods, look for a single-source meat, poultry or fish protein meal (such as “chicken meal” or “duck meal”) as the first ingredient. Since ingredients on a pet food label are listed in order of descending weight, “chicken meal” (which is already dried) as the first ingredient on a kibble bag is more desirable than “chicken” (which is mostly water). In other words, kibble made with a single-source meal as the first ingredient suggests the food has higher total meat content than a kibble made with fresh meat as the first ingredient."  (source:  http://www.naturesvariety.com/about/experts/Lauten).

von Harasymtzuk
When my retired female had her last litter I used the Professional Active with her after she had the litter and was nursing them.... she did really good on it. She maintained her weight good and had a great supply of milk.

No I do not have a degree, just started studying when one of my dogs had severe allergies a long time ago, she's passed now.  No offense taken, I want to learn as much as I possibly can.
Named Chicken or salmon meal does have A LOT less water content, around 10-20% so the protein content coming from meat is higher as opposed to cheap fillers to increase the protein and carbs, then say just chicken because like you said it's "meal."  At the same time you have to be careful about meat meals depending on the manufacteror as most of it is meat tossed to the side not good enough for human consumption and the problem with meal products is that they are more processed, thus losing nutrients but like I said no kibble provides enough nutrients, so adding some raw meat is good and supplements....

Artemis Puppy for example, the first 4 ingredients are not meals, just meat so the first ingredient and probably the second would be placed lower down in the ingredients because of the water but since it's followed by 2 more meat products, it still carries a lot of meat protein... the problem about chicken vs chicken meal is that meal is more processed, thus losing more valuable nutrients.  I have a lot of stuff written on my website, need to clean it up a bit, some of it is confusing to even me and I wrote it.


I'm very interested in learning more about supplements...as much as possible and I invite people to correct me if I'm wrong, really.

Thanks for the response, von Harasymtzuk.  I can understand the part about more processing for meal.  I give supplements (which my vet actually suggested) which include ester C, glucosamine/chondroitin, and fish oil.

I would definitely give kelp, probiotics and enzymes as well....works miracles.  I grabbed this off of my website real quick, they do so much more but I get tired of typing.  I am going to try Probiotic Miracle, it has a lot of live organisms in it, possibly more then Vetri.  Azmira also makes an enzyme supplement.  Kibble is processed, most if not all of the enzymes are killed.  I used to use Probios but this stuff is more powerful....I've seen the benefits of Vita C, probiotics, enzymes and kelp with my own eyes and it's backed by scientific fact...my first German Shepherd looked sick all the time, vets at that time didn't know how to help her just take our money so I started studying. 

Edit:  I like and use alfalfa too but just a pinch a few times a week, like kelp it's high in minerals and vitamins....Alfalfa can cause gas and some vets believe it can cause bloat if used too often.  Some of these supplements and others have been proven to help prevent cancer, and slow down aging.  I love enzymes especially for puppies, soak kibble in goats milk for 15 minutes, it turns into a mushy meal.  I start off with goats milk and hamburger though.



Probiotics: Vetri-Probiotics can be found at Revival Animal, Vetri-Mega Probiotic which can be found at Entirely Pets or Probiotic Miracle, a powder (can be found many places.)  This is a very cost efficient and is an extremely beneficial supplement, not only does it give back the good bacteria your dog is be losing from processed kibble but it also promotes a healthy digestive system allowing your puppy to absorb the nutrition that is in kibble much easier.  Probiotics provides resistance to diseases in the gastrointestinal tract, antioxidants, prevents colon cancer, helps with diarrhea, improved ability to handle stress, skin health, digestion health, reducing or eliminating allergic reactions, promotes a strong immune system allowing your dog to fight off viruses, disease and rebuilds the good bacteria after the administration of antibiotics, preventing problems in the female genital tract, prevention of bloat and overall it just keeps them healthy.  A good Probiotic should have at the very least 50 million CFU's to 1 billion+. 


Enzymes:    Enzymes are "organic catalysts". They either initiate or speed up chemical reactions in the body, from digestion to tissue repair, and from hormone function to energy production, they are present in every cell in both plants and animals.  There are two ways to obtain enzymes, food enzymes, and digestive enzymes.  For example if you eat raw vegetable you are getting live enzymes that support your digestive system, if you cook the carrot, you lose the enzymes.  The same thing applies to kibble that is cooked.  Benefits: Supports a healthy digestive system, helps to prevent bloat, acts as a natural treatment and sometimes a cure for dogs with allergies, stress/anxiety (which is great for some working dogs) Hypothyroidism, yeast infections and overall health.  Prozyme can be found at Revival Animal

Kelp: Kelp is important for maintaining health and is an excellent revitalizer. It can also promote better digestion, healthy skin and coat, healing from injuries, higher resistance to infection, larger litters and easier birthing. Kelp is great for increasing appetite, resistance to parasites and is an excellent source of naturally chelated macro and micro minerals. Kelp is also an important supplement for the thyroid gland high in fibre and includes a variety of of vitamins and minerals. Wholistic Sea Blend

I feed prey model raw and I LOVE it! I've never had better results with anything! 

I've also found it to be quite cheap- as cheap or cheaper than Ol' Roy, which I would never dream of feeding. I usually pay $0.30-1.00 per pound for raw versus $2.00 or so for TOTW. I figured it up once and Ol' Roy averages $0.69 per pound, so I usually get off cheaper even than that. 

I know things are different in different places, though. European friends tell me that feeding raw is very, very cost prohibitive over there.