NASS Studs - Page 2

Thank you both for taking the time to try to educate me without making me feel stupid!!  So, it sounds like the German system is pretty reliable.  However, I am a bit surprised that the hip scores are so accurate at such a young age.  

I still don't understand the ZW concept though. 

But, since I have no experience with the German system, I will have to take your word for it!!

I am glad that more breeders are starting to DM test and I hope they look into performing the other tests as well........

Sara

Hi smiley&gsd2727,
What is a DM test for? where can I learn more about it?.

http://rallhaus.com/DegenerativeMyelopathy.aspx

gives a basic explanation with a couple of links.

Sonora...you can get it done through the OFA: http://www.offa.org/dnatesting/dm.html

Here is another thread about it that may help you as well....

http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/german_shepherd_dog/forum.read?mnr=142824

sara

  Thank You very much, you all.

hello Sara, I feel that the German system is a much better indication of h/e health than OFA. It takes into account the status of the line/family. With OFA, one pup from a litter may certify and the rest fail and you may never know this.

If I had a dog with a high ZW, then I would consider doing OFA as a second opinion. My dog has a ZW of 74 and that number takes into account the score of the dogs behind her. I don't feel that OFA could give any better indication of her potential to produce a high % of good h/e.

The thryoid test is a good tool for breeders as this can affect reproduction. It can be pretty frustrating to put the time and finances into breeding and have the bitch miss. I did deal with this issue in the past and would not want to again.

best,
Rik

Leoetta- regarding your post on DM , i would like to point out some facts , while i have tested all of my dogs for this horrible disease it is very important that people understand that if a dog is at risk with one normal copy of the gene , he or she should not be excluded from breeding as the best study to date indicates that nearly 31% of all dogs tested fall in this category as a matter fact of this 31% no dog who falls in this category HAS EVER DEVELOPED DM, if you exclude the 31% and of course the 18% of dogs tested who have both abnormal genes then you have excluded nearly 50% of all who have tested and that would be unfortunate.I do absolutely agree that any dog who has both abnormal genes should not be bred but all research so far indicates that an N/A dog should not be summarily dismissed from breeding but i would agree that one should be more selective in choosing a breed partner.

Just because the minimum age for the a-stamp is 12 months, does not mean that all dogs with an a-stamp were evaluated at the minimum age. Some dogs are x-rayed at 24months+, it is at the discretion of the owner of the dog.

Regarding hip/elbow status at 12 months being a relaible indicator, from OFA themselves: http://www.offa.org/hd_prelims.html

A recent publication* compared the reliability of the preliminary evaluation hip grade phenotype with the 2 year old evaluation in dogs and there was 100% reliability for a preliminary grade of excellent being normal at 2 years of age (excellent, good, or fair). There was 97.9% reliability for a preliminary grade of good being normal at 2 years of age, and 76.9% reliability for a preliminary grade of fair being normal at 2 years of age. Reliability of preliminary evaluations increased as age at the time of preliminary evaluation increased, regardless of whether dogs received a preliminary evaluation of normal hip conformation or HD. For normal hip conformations, the reliability was 89.6% at 3-6 months, 93.8% at 7-12 months, and 95.2% at 13-18 months. These results suggest that preliminary evaluations of hip joint status in dogs are generally reliable. However, dogs that receive a preliminary evaluation of fair or mild hip joint conformation should be reevaluated at an older age (24 months).

*Corley, EA, et al. Reliability of Early Radiographic Evaluation for Canine Hip Dysplasia Obtained from the Standard Ventrodorsal Radiographic Projection. JAVMA. Vol 211, No. 9, November 1997.

 

Hoosier - I agree with you 100% , never said I would not breed a carrier (of course always to an N/N dog). My friends dog that I said tested AT RISK tested to carry two abnormal copies of the gene A/A, which is so far the only result they have seen to exhibit symptoms, they have yet to see it in a carrier A/N tested dog. I just happen to only have N/N Clear dogs in my program right now, literally just the luck of the draw with them as they were all imported before being tested. I had one female that was tested A/N that I rehomed but that was due to the fact that she never was able to get pregnant, nothing to do with her results as she would have been bred to my N/N male. I just hope others catch on soon and join us in testing their dogs!

The German system is better. OFA only looks at one view of the hips where the German system as well as the system from Penn Hip offers the best overall view of the dogs hips with THREE required views. If I was going to get my dog certified, I would go with Penn Hip over OFA.