Breed Survey Class 1 - Page 3

So what about the imports that fail in Germany but pass in the UK? Is that ok then? In this instance I agree with Missbeeb, the poster of this thread could have gone direct to the breeders for the explanation before bringing it onto this site and then if not satisfied with the reply bring it up at the Breed Council, why does everybody feel the need to victimise people by insisting on airing it on here?

Carole (noddi) you said ,maybe he thought it needed to be brought out into the open. this has NEVER been covered up, it is out in the Open, when the female was old enough the owner/breeders had her screened for both countries as they wanted to exhibit her in Germany, they could have just paid for one set of Xrays if they had wanted. This Kennel sent the Xrays into the BVA but they didnt have to, they could have just instructed the vet not to send them in. Look at it this way Carole, if the bitch you talk about had her xrays assessed under the German system to 'a' stamp satisfaction would you have restricted your breeding to the BVA result when your dog could have got a German Korung? Of course you wouldnt, would you have questioned the authenticity of the BVA result, possibly and many would say understandably!!  The same if it was the other way around, if your dog failed in Germany but passed in the UK.

This is not the first kennel this has happened to in the UK and doubt it will be the last. Visa versa, there are dogs (Imports as well as home bred) who have passed the UK BC Survey that cannot get a Korung in Germany. Which system is right? Dont ask me, probably both in their own way, as both look at different area's on the joints when grading. Malcolm Willis always says in the BVA system the points scored at the top half of the BVA scoresheet are less important (as far as been relevant to causing a disabilitating problem) than the scores at the bottom half. So perhaps the German system is more tollerent of the areas on the hip that effect point scoring at the top half but fail everything with even the slightest annomoly on areas of the hips covered by the bottom part of the score sheet. Much the same as DNA tests here in the UK and in Germany, the German DNA test prove parentage, the UK ones dont which to me is a pointless excersise as what is the point to having a DNA test at all if not to prove parentage?

 At the end of the day the decision had to be made, if we are to accept both systems individually then we have to accept whichever system is presented at the time, otherwise which system out of the two do we ultimately accept? You cant have it both ways, so there is no complicated decision to be made here, we either always accept both systems (which means we accept either) or we dont, it is actually that simple.
 
Regards
Sue b

i agree with misbeeb.there should be one system for all gsds.can this be brought up at the meeting they have after the german sieger show?if this was the case then there could be no cheating.

I would say that the best way to work this would be if the dog/bitch is born here in the UK then it must go through the UK system you can put it through the German one if you wish, but it must be done under our system if born here not a mix match of UK/German That means under our BVA/Hips/elbows Heam Test etc  not hips a normal elbows 0/0 it would need to get a BVA score done on its hips before it could be syrveyed then that way their can be no doubt about said dog/bitch or trying to cheat the system So German born German KKl British born British survey.
jim h

HI Jim
You have come up with the answer to a complex problem
I think the breed council should make it happen.

s ue,hiya and here we go again.i agree,that this situation is not straight forward now that we can show abroad.but i do believe that if the animal is born in the uk or is imported into the uk to be shown and to produce then said animal should be scored over here within our scheme.yu have it in a nutshell when yu said Davy and joan had the bitch scored in germany so she could be shown there,so that says that germany DOES NOT ACCEPT OUR SCORING SYSTEM for our animals to be shown or bred over there,so i say its only right that the same applies here.there have been discrepencies in not only our breed but others with regard to the system in germany.it makes one wonder when animals are given an a stamo normal in germany,which i was told was equivalent to around 5-10 in our system,who when scored here in uk,bva system,was total in the fifties.which 1 is more correct,heaven only knows.Google isn,t the only person on these threads that have commented on this,see letter oct.issue 2009,breed council magazine and if i remember there was another case as well.tell me,if yu had a bitch with the same score as my otti(who didnt get surveyed)now and put her in for the survey and got a fail yet yu discovered that a bitch had a bva score(for fail)but was a stamp normal and koreunged and was given a class 1 even tho her total bva score was higher than your bitch that yu wouldnt be angry.and to your statement that yu reckon that if my bitch had the samegerman qualifications as this bitch i would also do as davy did,then yu are greatly mistaken.i have said what i would have done. and most categorically would have expected and accepted a fail.maybe yu could bring this up at the next breed council meeting as i think several other people have come on ths thread stating the same as me.. Carole

As i said earlier if british bred then must go through our system regardless if german bred then can go through both if needed but if it has a kkl then it should be accepted here if not a kkl then must pass through our system with BVA etc but if british bred then must be british system not half and half  SIMPLES.
jim h