usca-gsdca/wda,,, conflict how - Page 2

the minutes meeting lists those as new business, but doesnt state if it passed or had been voted on, at least as of yet. But then again, I didnt know that there was a yahoo group. Guess have to look for it to keep up with what is changing. The USCA website can be confusing in this point.

Elkoorr - I know it can get confusing - now that is an agenda which lists the new business, not minutes.  Agendas and attachments if needed are done by a reaquired time period before the meeting and distrubuted to people who will be voting on the issues.  The meeting takes place.  Minutes are taken during the meeting.  Those recordings, shorthand, whatever of what was said in the meeting are then transcribed into the formal minutes that are published.

Nia usually posts during all meetings how the votes went on the USA Yahoo Group.  The USA Yahoo Group requires membership in USA.  If you are a member of USA , go to http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/USA-GSD/  and sign up as a member - you will need your USA membership number.

If you do go there, sign up,  the thread is GMB and it starts with Message # 40550 with the voting and then takes you through the rest of the day of voting.  The minutes on the USA site in the past have files labeled like 2008GBMminutes.pdf  I assume that they will keep with that document title format and it will be 2009GBMminutes.pdf when it is published.

Actually, I am glad you mistook the agenda attachments with the bylaw changes as what happened, this way I can help make clear what those documents represent, and how everyone knew what passed who was not directly in the meeting.  Also, not only were the posts occuring in real time on the voting, but other people in the meeting were contacting those that could not attend.  November 5th was not a day of coming together, but rather a day of seperatism.

The whole, well 90% of it,  meeting and agenda was about restriction in membership and USA activities.  Bottomline you have to be a member to do just about anything with them, at least to participate in trials, shows, helper activities. And if you are a member with them, you cannot belong to any other organization in the United States which has GSD's.

I just assumed that these rule changes affected the clubs affiliation!  One club could not be affiliated with more than one dsd club? this past weekend I discovered that the USCA  has decided that I can not be a member of GSD wda or any other association and a member of usca  at the same time!  Well excuse me please! Next I suppose you will tell me I can only drink germen beer1 Folks when these private clubs become so arrogant that they think they can tell us what associations we can or cannot belong to it is time to leave them and let them go belly up ! I pay my dues and abide by their rules about the dog but when they infringe on my freedom enough is enough! It is tough enough dealing with those few arrogant assholes in the dog world let alone allowing them to tell us how to run our private lifes!

Thanks Kim for posting the link to the yahoo group. I was busy this weekend with our own club trial. I understand that i posted the link to the agenda, and knew that the two docs were going together. wish USA would update the website faster, especial when the changes are so affecting of everyone. But just checked again, and still no minutes posted. I have to see if I am approved for the yahoo group. This will sure help to stay on top of everything.

 I had to re-do my BH and then a sch1 instead of a 1 and a 2 because of this crap. i trained so hard because of my surgery coming up and now i wont be ready to trial until a year from now . Im so pissed off about it and at the same time happy my dog did well.

i hate it when politics interfer with my dog training.  oh well,  que sera, sera ( or however it is spelled)

my understanding is you dont have to  be a usca member, but a member of usca or another awdf club to trial at a usca trial.   of course you must be a usca member to compete at regional/ nationa events.   

john

smartguy, who told you that you have to redo the BH?

If smartguy did his BH and his SchH1 at a WDA trial there are a couple of scenarios -

If they were done under a WDA judge - USA will not accept a score from a WDA judge nor a WDA Scorebook.

If they were done under an SV judge and only recorded in a WDA scorebook and not also recorded in the USA accepted scorebook (theirs or AWDF) , USA will not recognize them.  Now my personal opinion on that is that if it was brought to the SV's attention that USA would not recognize an SV trial judge just because it was written on a different piece of paper, that the SV would probably say it should be accepted. No one has ever challenged this and complained to the SV.

Also, and this is a big one that people never seem to understand, USA offers 2 kinds of Koerungs that are both issued through the SV - one is a Koerung recognized only by USA and no other organziation in the world.  The other is the real SV one that is recognized anywhere in the world.

The requirement for the real SV one is that you must have a BH and one of your SchH titles under and SV judge same for your show card and AD. 

For the Koerung that is only recognized by USA, you can have any USA judge.

WDA will recognize al working titles given by USA judges and the USA scorebook. 

I have never had a scorebook other than USA's. USA, SV, DVG, and WDA scores are all recorded in the same USA scorebook. Yes, USA has accepted verification of all WDA titles from SV judges if recorded in the USA scorebook.  All of my dogs have been SV/USA registered.

However, one always must provide the USA office with proof of titles won at trials earned at other organizations. If the dog is USA/SV registered, then, all titles are included in USA's database. Also, USA will notify the SV of all titles for inclusion in the SV's database. Furthermore, USA has verification of all titles and breed surveys (with SV judges) done with WDA clubs.

The first dog I titled earned his AD, BH, SchH1 and SchH2 under USA judges at USA clubs. The SchH3 was completed under an SV judge at a USA trial. USA has this info in its database and forwarded verification of titles to the SV to be recorded in its database. However, if the SchH3 had not been with an SV judge, the dog's titles would not be included in the SV's database.

Somewhat complcated--one must cover all of one's bases. One cannot leave anything to chance. If in doubt, call the USA office. The have always been helpful in the past--they have even called the SV when clarification was needed. Similarly, one must also provide to the WDA office verification of all titles/breed surveys achieved at USA events with SV judges.

All of this requires organizational skills and the sending and receiving of many original documents via certified mail to the offices of both USA and the WDA.

Don't know what will happen when the "Johannes amendment" becomes effective. I may do my own foundation training at home and just send future generations to Germany for titles/breed surveys. It will be several years down the road before I have another dog ready for titling.