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by Videx on 21 February 2011 - 16:02
There are three major GSD organisations covering the whole of Great Britain - I don't count the "UK Alsatian Club” as relevant to this comment. I can also dismiss BAGSD because they have clearly proved to the overwhelming majority of GSD folk here in Great Britain and around the world that they are also largely irrelevant.
The GSD Breed Council (BC) and The GSD League (GSDL) are the two major National GSD Organisations.
The GSD Breed Council is NOT a Kennel Club licensed breed club; it is simply a forum for discussion for the GSD with representation channels to the Kennel Club. With the agreement of the BC member GSD Breed Clubs, may co-ordinate various shows and events, and publishes a monthly magazine.
The GSD League is the oldest British National GSD Breed Club, and has a very proud record of doing what the Breed Council currently does and much more, and in my opinion doing it far better. The GSD League is a Kennel Club licensed GSD Breed Club, it publishes a magnificent Club magazine (FREE to members), it is a member club of the WUSV (World GSD organisation), and it is steadily introducing the GSDL/WUSV System into Great Britain. The GSD League is constantly assessing future progressive developments for our GSD breed within the UK, and has many supporters throughout Great Britain and around the World, including the WUSV, and its numerous National GSD Breed Club members.
The GSDL/WUSV System has now embraced a Regional Group of affiliated GSD Clubs and they are examining many options regarding "the way forward". There are matters which the “Regional Group” will be aware of which are at various stages of discussion within the group. These matters will tend to be confidential until agreements are reached; however there have been some headline communications from the Regional Group as to some of the key issues under discussion.
I therefore readily understand the need for some restraint from GSDL/WUSV Regional Group members on making any public comments.
The issue of the GSD Breed Survey is a case in point. I am very firmly of the opinion that in Great Britain we need to ensure that we include within the Breed Survey those very important aspects which are centred on IDENTIFICATION, e.g. Microchip/Tattoo and DNA parentage Tests, and also Health Screening Tests, e.g. Hips, Elbows etc. I also very firmly believe that we should NOT include any working tests whatsoever, until such time that our GSD Breed Survey has achieved well in excess of 2000 - yes two thousand GSD - going through are GSD breed Survey each year. I will make further comments on this point later.
The most crucial aspect of our GSD Breed Survey is for it to gain universal and widespread use by British GSD Breeders, so that the British GSD Puppy buying public will largely insist on a GSD puppy from GSD Breed Surveyed parents, just as they do now with hip scoring.
For the Breed Council to have introduced the Kennel Club Good Citizens Bronze Award as a requirement in our GSD Breed Survey is what I firmly consider a very serious retrograde step to the future development of the Survey and the potential growth in the GSD numbers that will be put through the GSD Breed Survey. It proves nothing of any additional importance, and it has introduced a Kennel Club qualification into our GSD Breed Survey which is not recognised in any way for ANY Kennel Club licensed show. On the other hand
The GSD Breed Council (BC) and The GSD League (GSDL) are the two major National GSD Organisations.
The GSD Breed Council is NOT a Kennel Club licensed breed club; it is simply a forum for discussion for the GSD with representation channels to the Kennel Club. With the agreement of the BC member GSD Breed Clubs, may co-ordinate various shows and events, and publishes a monthly magazine.
The GSD League is the oldest British National GSD Breed Club, and has a very proud record of doing what the Breed Council currently does and much more, and in my opinion doing it far better. The GSD League is a Kennel Club licensed GSD Breed Club, it publishes a magnificent Club magazine (FREE to members), it is a member club of the WUSV (World GSD organisation), and it is steadily introducing the GSDL/WUSV System into Great Britain. The GSD League is constantly assessing future progressive developments for our GSD breed within the UK, and has many supporters throughout Great Britain and around the World, including the WUSV, and its numerous National GSD Breed Club members.
The GSDL/WUSV System has now embraced a Regional Group of affiliated GSD Clubs and they are examining many options regarding "the way forward". There are matters which the “Regional Group” will be aware of which are at various stages of discussion within the group. These matters will tend to be confidential until agreements are reached; however there have been some headline communications from the Regional Group as to some of the key issues under discussion.
I therefore readily understand the need for some restraint from GSDL/WUSV Regional Group members on making any public comments.
The issue of the GSD Breed Survey is a case in point. I am very firmly of the opinion that in Great Britain we need to ensure that we include within the Breed Survey those very important aspects which are centred on IDENTIFICATION, e.g. Microchip/Tattoo and DNA parentage Tests, and also Health Screening Tests, e.g. Hips, Elbows etc. I also very firmly believe that we should NOT include any working tests whatsoever, until such time that our GSD Breed Survey has achieved well in excess of 2000 - yes two thousand GSD - going through are GSD breed Survey each year. I will make further comments on this point later.
The most crucial aspect of our GSD Breed Survey is for it to gain universal and widespread use by British GSD Breeders, so that the British GSD Puppy buying public will largely insist on a GSD puppy from GSD Breed Surveyed parents, just as they do now with hip scoring.
For the Breed Council to have introduced the Kennel Club Good Citizens Bronze Award as a requirement in our GSD Breed Survey is what I firmly consider a very serious retrograde step to the future development of the Survey and the potential growth in the GSD numbers that will be put through the GSD Breed Survey. It proves nothing of any additional importance, and it has introduced a Kennel Club qualification into our GSD Breed Survey which is not recognised in any way for ANY Kennel Club licensed show. On the other hand
by Videx on 21 February 2011 - 16:02
Continued:
for the GSDL/WUSV Regional Events and also our annual GSD British Sieger, the GSD Breed Survey is FUNDAMENTAL to their ENTRY CRITERIA.
Kennel Club Shows do not have any entry requirement for tattoo/microchip or for hips & elbow scores. Entries simply have to be Kennel Club registered.
I am definitely not trying to demean the KC Good Citizens Scheme. It is fine for those that wish to participate in it for their pleasure and want to achieve a Kennel Club qualification. I am of the very firm opinion that it has absolutely NO place forming any part of the requirements for our GSD Breed Survey Scheme.
When our GSD Clubs/Organisations directly involved in the GSDL/WUSV Regional Events, consider it is time to introduce some initial working Tests/Qualifications into our GSD Breed Survey, and I trust it will be a minimum of 5 years away, I sincerely believe they must base their considerations on elements of the SV BH (traffic of life) test and maybe some elements of the SV Körung and maybe the SV AD (endurance) test. I must stress my very firm opinion of waiting until our breed has over 2000 GSD per year going through our GSD Breed Survey, although once it reaches over 1000 per year consideration to introducing some initial working test at some future date could commence.
We all must remember our GSDL/WUSV Events are very clearly TWO systems running together and this must be maintained to retain CHOICE and INCLUSIVITY for all participating GSD owners. ONE is the full SV/WUSV System which culminates with the Working Classes which require the FULL SV/WUSV qualifications e.g. AD, BH, SchH1, 2, 3. and/or IPO1, 2, 3. A Show grade and the SV/WUSV Körung (SV/WUSV breed survey = allowed to breed). TWO is the GSDL/WUSV British System which culminates in the Adult Classes which requires the GSD Breed Survey. It is very important to remember that GSD following either system will compete together in ALL OTHER CLASSES.
Always remembering that Long Coats are separately scheduled classes.
Importantly, the future development of our GSD Breed Survey must only consider elements within the SV/WUSV System, for as much as I strongly advocate the absolute RETENTION of the ADULT Classes and therefore the GSDL/WUSV British System, (because not everyone wants to train their dogs and qualify under the SV system, most particularly the protection phase), we must ensure that the differences are only by comparison with the FULL SV/WUSV System. This clearly facilitates any owner who may wish to progress from the GSDL/WUSV British System to the SV/WUSV System with any of their dogs.
To introduce the KC Good Citizens test into our GSD Breed Survey is totally unnecessary and this is something that should be strenuously avoided.
THIS IS OUR GSDL/WUSV SYSTEM - NOT - A BRITISH "HOTCH POTCH" GSD SYSTEM
The Kennel Club have a system - The GSD breed also has the two GSDL/WUSV Systems
Anyone can participate in ALL THREE Systems as long as their GSD meet the entry criteria
for the GSDL/WUSV Regional Events and also our annual GSD British Sieger, the GSD Breed Survey is FUNDAMENTAL to their ENTRY CRITERIA.
Kennel Club Shows do not have any entry requirement for tattoo/microchip or for hips & elbow scores. Entries simply have to be Kennel Club registered.
I am definitely not trying to demean the KC Good Citizens Scheme. It is fine for those that wish to participate in it for their pleasure and want to achieve a Kennel Club qualification. I am of the very firm opinion that it has absolutely NO place forming any part of the requirements for our GSD Breed Survey Scheme.
When our GSD Clubs/Organisations directly involved in the GSDL/WUSV Regional Events, consider it is time to introduce some initial working Tests/Qualifications into our GSD Breed Survey, and I trust it will be a minimum of 5 years away, I sincerely believe they must base their considerations on elements of the SV BH (traffic of life) test and maybe some elements of the SV Körung and maybe the SV AD (endurance) test. I must stress my very firm opinion of waiting until our breed has over 2000 GSD per year going through our GSD Breed Survey, although once it reaches over 1000 per year consideration to introducing some initial working test at some future date could commence.
We all must remember our GSDL/WUSV Events are very clearly TWO systems running together and this must be maintained to retain CHOICE and INCLUSIVITY for all participating GSD owners. ONE is the full SV/WUSV System which culminates with the Working Classes which require the FULL SV/WUSV qualifications e.g. AD, BH, SchH1, 2, 3. and/or IPO1, 2, 3. A Show grade and the SV/WUSV Körung (SV/WUSV breed survey = allowed to breed). TWO is the GSDL/WUSV British System which culminates in the Adult Classes which requires the GSD Breed Survey. It is very important to remember that GSD following either system will compete together in ALL OTHER CLASSES.
Always remembering that Long Coats are separately scheduled classes.
Importantly, the future development of our GSD Breed Survey must only consider elements within the SV/WUSV System, for as much as I strongly advocate the absolute RETENTION of the ADULT Classes and therefore the GSDL/WUSV British System, (because not everyone wants to train their dogs and qualify under the SV system, most particularly the protection phase), we must ensure that the differences are only by comparison with the FULL SV/WUSV System. This clearly facilitates any owner who may wish to progress from the GSDL/WUSV British System to the SV/WUSV System with any of their dogs.
To introduce the KC Good Citizens test into our GSD Breed Survey is totally unnecessary and this is something that should be strenuously avoided.
THIS IS OUR GSDL/WUSV SYSTEM - NOT - A BRITISH "HOTCH POTCH" GSD SYSTEM
The Kennel Club have a system - The GSD breed also has the two GSDL/WUSV Systems
Anyone can participate in ALL THREE Systems as long as their GSD meet the entry criteria
by den on 21 February 2011 - 19:02
I agree with you David,i was going to take several young dogs to GSD OF WALES to have their Breed Surveys but am now unable to as they do not have the now required KC Bronze citizen,and i feel that more dogs will be in the same situation.
by jaymesie51 on 21 February 2011 - 20:02
yes there are a few here as well, that wont and will not be getting the KC bronze thingy, if that excludes them from the regionals then so be it, but the funny thing is they wont be excluded from the KC shows for not having a KC bronze, just how silly is that,
jim
jim
by arbeiter on 22 February 2011 - 16:02
It would appear that the KC have played a trump card in trying to block the GSD league's new shows, knowing full well that the show people of the correct GSD rarely do KC citzen schemes.The way round it is to have a GSD league survey scheme.The Breed Council should be disbandoned and every thing go through the GSD League,as the only creditable organisation left for GSD's.
by jaymesie51 on 22 February 2011 - 17:02
it has nothing to do with the KC it was the BC that lumped us with the Bronze citizens in our Breed Surveys not the KC.
jim h
jim h
by arbeiter on 22 February 2011 - 17:02
Correct me if I am wrong, does not the KC run the Good Citizen Scheme ?
It's what's known as " back door politics ". jaymesie you must not think everyone is as nieve as yourself.
by jaymesie51 on 22 February 2011 - 17:02
Arbiter first things first read what i wrote, and i will say again nothing to do with the KC it was our breed council that made the citizens a requirement in our breed surveys. so how can it be back door politics when the KC have nothing whatsoever to do with including this in our breed surveys.
jim h
jim h
by rachel on 22 February 2011 - 18:02
so people who just show there young dogs after hip scoring and elbows
cannot get a breed survey.I don't know it seams very unfair to people who
train for ring craft
cannot get a breed survey.I don't know it seams very unfair to people who
train for ring craft
by arbeiter on 22 February 2011 - 19:02
Jaymesie- We would be interested in your thoughts as to why after all these years would the Breed Council suddenly include KC Citizen schemes? When they cannot get the KC to include health concerns before participating in KC shows.I still say " back door politics ".
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