MANUS V TIEKERHOOK PUPS FATHER DAUGHTER MATING ?. - Page 4

"He is an amazing dog and although his character may be too much to win trophies he is definatley an ANIMAL you use to produce such"

Hi Sujay; Manus is a nice dog, certainly not too "much to win trophies" in the right hands; can't really comment on your breeding plans, but will say it's my opinion that with better and more consistent, assertive training Manus would have got a lot further than he did on the schutzhund field- don't consider him to be a headbanger at all, and that's not being critical. Told your Dad Arnie this on a number of occasions. 

Nugget

the only problem I would see come from this type of breeding would be that not just any body will be able to handle them.  you probably got extreme drives with this litter? strong aggression? high energy?  these won't be "pet dogs".  then again the lines you bred aren't really for the "pet market" anyway.

but then again, not everybody should own a gsd in the first place,  it sounds like most of the litter was placed or you are keeping most.  

I don't particularly see what the big deal is.  like many other people have already posted, it is COMMON PRATICE in other breeds to do tight inbreeding to FIX traits.  if you know the lines well,  and more importantly, you know your own dogs well,  you should not have major health issue's.  you can have just as many health issue's pop up in a outcrossed litter, and yes even mix breeds are plagued with problems.  I would much rather buy a linebred dog than I would a completely out crossed one for breeding purposes...  you know more of what to expect out of a inbred or linebred dog.

JMO

Jennifer

Wasn't there a thread a couple months back that was along the same lines as this?  some man in New York did several gen. close inbreeding and it made a few breeders get their panties in a wad?  He wasn't even selling his litters to the public or civilians.

maybe Dr. Suess said it best:

"Be who you are and say what you feel because those
who mind don't matter and those who matter don't
mind." -Dr. Seuss

Jennifer

Just like to clear one more thing.

Manus is not a what I consider a competition podium dog. Yes he would do much better in someone elses hands other than mine - maybe even win the odd trial and make a place on the team - like you said with consisitent training. But he is not going to put out a performance the majority of the sports fraternity are looking for.

I have sold most of my stock now to spend time on him and I will title him and trial him or at least try until his last days - especially now I have a few willing friends that have some experience with this calibre of animal.

Nobody said he was a Headbanger - that is not the sort of dog you would be inbreeding on (asuming you were).

He is special - very special and in terms of quality, work ethic, reproductive abilities and bloodlines he is in my personal opinion unmatched in the UK.

well looks like it will be a good one and i am a big fan of Nick.however,i was wondering about what Manus has produced so far and if there are any examples i can take a look somewhere since i do not really know this dog.i do like the picture of him lokks like my type of dog and certainly has a big head and powerfull.

DEAR OH DEAR WHY DO SO MANY OF YOU THINK YOU HAVE THE GOD GIVEN RIGHT TO TINKER WITH NATURE.

ITS NOT FOR THE LOVE OF DOGS, ITS FOR THE LOVE OF YOURSELVES AND YOUR EGO'S

SUJAY.       You started your post of very well and very sensibly and I was enjoying reading it,  then .....BANG .......... you totally ruined it by your very sweeping statement at the end ............. that in your opinion your dog is unmatched in the  U.K.  !!!!!!!!!.

To make it even worse you are talking about a dog without titles are you not  ?????. !!!!. 

Dare I ask if he has any hip and elbow grades or haemophilia clear test ? ( these are all standard and expected for reputable stud dogs in the U.K. ) .

Come on Sujay , not everybody is not that silly !.  I am not disputing that Manus is a nice dog and that you are more than passionate about him but to make a statement like that its insulting to other good dogs and their owners .

There ARE other nice dogs in the U.K. and some with impeccable proven respected working bloodlines and titled !. 

 So please don't  infer that there are not any other good dogs in the U.K. !   and no I don't own one myself but I am going to use one !.

HELD.   Thats a very good point !,  and well said BRADY BEE !.

There was one other small thing I didnt mention ......... the dog I am going to use is most certainly not   HANDLER AGGRESSIVE  either !.  ring any bells Sujay ?.

"DEAR OH DEAR WHY DO SO MANY OF YOU THINK YOU HAVE THE GOD GIVEN RIGHT TO TINKER WITH NATURE.

ITS NOT FOR THE LOVE OF DOGS, ITS FOR THE LOVE OF YOURSELVES AND YOUR EGO'S"

And you are here why? You can say the same quote about any person who owns any dog, not just someone who breeds tight.

"So please don't  infer that there are not any other good dogs in the U.K. !   and no I don't own one myself but I am going to use one !."

He never said anything negative about any others dogs so what are you talking about nut bag? Anyone in their right mind, who "doesn't" think their dog is the shiznit, has no business breeding that dog IMO! You don't own a dog but are going to use one? WTF are you talking about? Your here again why and have done what in the breed? What do you even know about GSD's? Answers blk/red and 4 legs don't count.

Oh for gawd sake - the god given right to tinker with nature. Gimma a break............. Left to their own devices dogs will mate with their mother, father, sister, brother, cousins and all relatives in between often on the same day. Dogs are incestual creatures ......and that's nature, baby.

Is it 5 o'clock somewhere? Reading this board is driving me to having an adult beverage way before happy hour EST.