Do you own and cope with an anti-social Shepherd? - Page 3

My 20 month old DDR female GSD is somewhat antisocial, but we are able to manage and live comfortably with her as a family member. She displays a habitual stalking crouch and intense aggression upon seeing other dogs ( big, small, male, female ). If she is introduced she approaches the dog with a tall stance; if the other dog lies down or bend down shes fine. If the other dog stares back at her, a vocal spat ( with intention to fight ) immediately follows and then the dogs are pulled away from each other.
With people shes fine if she is allowed to do the approaching and the person remains completely still; she will sniff and then ready to move on. If there is movement/ staring and/ or talking from the person she fires off.
At home shes completely stable with family and loves to play ball in the house with everyone.

Life goes on .

^ case study in how to fail your dog.

gsdstudent, it wasn't advice. My dog used to have bad greeting behavior. Training can easily fix that. I find that many say their dogs are dog aggressive when they aren't. To me there is a difference between a dog that wants to attack another dog and one that is barking because they don't know how to say hello properly. I would think the training and management for each would be a tad bit different as both would have vastly different underlying reasons for what they do.

Prager has posted an excellent post here .. I would advise reading it several times ...
No you don't need simply a good trainer, you need someone that is competent for this aggression !! .. You need someone that can understand you and your dog for starters and one that has full knowledge in canine behavior especially aggression . I will advise , that many really don't understand aggression -or how to treat it - they think they do . If the person cannot explain to you the origin of the aggression, then most likely they cannot help you and the dog .
Remember , YOU are as much a variable as the dog. If they don't have the capability to work with you too ,then walk away . Some trainers may be able to train , but not everybody can explain and teach people - again , they think they do . Watch them interact with other people and their dogs first !! Or depend on other people who know the trainer and have gotten results.
In short.. I could give a two day seminar on your situation ... They should explain to you : to what degree the aggression is genetic based , to what did degree it is learning/environmental based or the Combination of the two . The type of aggression[s] the dog displays also . There could be more than one factor occurring at the same time to . They should discuss exactly what triggers the aggression and what you do and what is expected of the dog.
EQUALLY important is you .. what about you ? ... everything ! You and the dog are intragrally connected whether one wants to address this , acknowledge this or not. For example , The dilation of your eyes , your breathing , your posture, your voice [ all the components of it] , your movement or non-movement ... these effect and affect the dog's behavior . One has to master himself before he can change the dog's behavior . I work with people on intensely !! What we do , think , feel adds to or subtracts from the dog's behavior in the event of aggression .
Prager was alluding to this, as a portion of YOUR role . AND...... YES ... he can, in a way , read the dog's mind !!!!!. Someone working with you can teach you to !! .. And no ... you do not read body language , in the sense that the meaning of that expression is misleading. NO , you see the CHANGE of the body language. That is what is telling you what the dog is thinking , feeling and intentions , which let's you interact with the dog in a more productive manner. But I purposely reference this because at times , IT IS possible to tell what the dog is going to do , even before he does it ! In dog training that we say ," dogs anticipate ", don't we? They read us , and better than we read them , don't they ? . We can do at that to them too !!
I'll explain.. but first let me liken this when two people are together and you both think at the same time , and say at the same time , the same exact words !! That is not happen chance.. happens to many ,many people , doesn't it ? And here is why : OUR brains are neuro-chemically related . In a very real sense the impulses in our brains , produces an action in us which results in instantaneous stimulation of signals in another's brain in less than nano second time, less then a blinking of an eye in turn produces action from them. Scientific fact , it is proven repeatedly , and has been shown to occur in people . We are even down to a neuro chemical basis are minds , as a certain fact ,linked / connected. So aren't we with our animals .
Therefore , anyone well experienced can highly anticipate , to a certain reliable degree , what another person or dog is going to do . Sports people do this all the time with their teammates , especially in hockey , They know where their teammate is going to be on the ice even before they pass a puck , yes? With an aggressive dog... this is IMPORTANT ,.this is why I write so much .. It's critical !!
Now it is useless to tell someone the best time to discipline a dog for an unwanted behavior is exactly when the dog is even thinking of that behavior if it weren't possible. For example if a dog breaks a sit position , the best time to prevent the break is as the dog thinks about it ? Right , Isn't that taught in basic OB classes ? If we had no way to do that. Isn't that foolish to tell someone to correct the dog at that time if , you couldn't know what the dog is thinking. Yet ,many teach that in OB , right?
One more thing ... if a trainer cannot tell you what a dog is motivated for , thinks and feels in situations .. then walk away . I never ever interact with people and a dog unless i understand 100% the dog, why it behaves as it does , and how I can change the dog internally [ it's mind] to have the dog behave/ perform the way i want it to . And know ahead of time : the more an aggressive behavior is genetically based then more so that aggressive behavior can only be managed by you .

 Centurian.

 

Rodeo, the one thing I don't see in Centurian's otherwise

very good post ^^^ is anything specific about owner/handler

TIMING.  The ability not only to learn to predict what

your dog is going to do, but to get in there and match

the speed of that.  This takes some concentration and

practice but it is worth it for the results.  As he says,

you can get to the point where you can anticipate what

your dog is about to do.  But that knowledge is only

going to pay off for you if you learn the speed at which

to intervene.  For which, you really have to KNOW your

dog;  and that means concentrating on getting to under-

stand the dog, even if you have to shut out everything

else.  Too often I have stood in Training Classes (among

other situations) and watched as peoples' dogs did things

that could have been nipped in the bud, but the owner is

chatting to another handler, or distracted by their cell, or

just staring into space, wool-gathering, rather than watching

& really concentrating on their dog.  In the case of a dog

which is flying at other dogs and/or people, that becomes

three times as important !

As I said in my earlier post, it is possible to overcome this

problem by training, but you have to train yourself as much

as your dog.  Good luck.

The last 2 posts above this one Centurion and Hundmutter are excellent posts. I call training of the brain by predicting what the dog going to do and correcting it before it does Minority report ( Tom Cruise) training after the movie of the same name. In that movie there was a media which could predict who is going to commit murder. That person then was executed before they committed the crime. I would suggest that instead having a dog you live with the dog. Go hiking, and for the ride with the dog and stay camping over night in the woods or desert just you and the dog - sleep under the open sky in a sleeping bag w dog next to you. You will bond really well and learn to read the dog and understand the timing if you live with the dog. Hundmutter timing post is also excellent remainder of important part of training. When in the club watching other people train their dogs do not chat with others - time for that later- watch your dog - that will teach you what they think and timing in which they react to what is in front of them. Also when I train obedience I teach the timing to the dog. Always during your training routine and then in every day life, command and correct or reward in same rhythm. Your training session should be like a dance in a ballroom. During dance the partner knows in advance what you will do and vice versa in precise timing. That then leads the dog to understand the command, what to expect that will come next and when it will come ( timing).   Why am I talking about all this in post about aggression? The reason is because the understanding of your dog's aggression and how to control it stars way before you encounter it for real. It starts in situations Centurion and Hundmutter and I am talking about. If you live with your dog and use +/- training using all 4 pillars of psychology of training rather then just keeping it, then the undesirable aggression may never come. And that is the best way to deal with it  and to avoid it. You and your dog will be attuned to each other and dog will not do what you do not like. Dog will work for you. Such relationship with dog is more exhilarating and rewarding to me then I can ever achieve in winning any competition. And in order to win competition  do it in a way that the dog is not a machine but it is part of you. One practical exercise you can try. Tie the dog to your waist by leash (Centurion mentioned it) and keep him there as long as you can even ALL DAY. Yes you will trip over each other for a while but then it will be like that dance I was talking about before. And on top of it the dog will learn that you are the leader and what you like and dislike and the timing and reading each other. In the end I will say this. If your dog does something wrong THEN IT IS YOUR FAULT AND NOT THE DOG'S. Think about it.

 Prager Hans