CDRM or Degenerative Myelopathy in Working Line GSD? - Page 4

Thanks Marjorie!

it sounded so much alike except that he said his was progressing rapidly. I am not sure what rapidly is verses slow progression in DM. Weeks, months.

DM can progress, with each stage, in a 3-6 month course, untreated. If it progresses more towards the 3 month time frame ,than the 6 month time frame, that is considered to be rapidly progressing.

Problem with DM is that all too often it is used as a *catch all* phrase. This allows other  problems to be overlooked. Very few do ALL the diagnostics. They will do PART of the diagnostics, but not ALL, which is unfortunate, as there are so many conditions that mimic DM resulting in another potentially treatable condition to go untreated :( An EMG allows the problem to be isolated to a specific area. An MRI cannot tell you, alone, if a dog has other problems that could be related to a LOWER Neuron disease, or an Upper neuron disease. I hate when a vet looks at an MRI and says clear MRI= DM. Example: ALS is a LMN disease, while DM is an UPN disease..( This is my problem with DR Coates claim that DM is ALS. They are 2 very different diseases).  A CSF will tell you if there are any inflammatory cells, which is an important part of the diagnosis.  Pain free is not a dx- once nerve cells die off, there can be no pain, as the nerve cells are dead. Nerve cells can die off from being compressed for a period of time.  This can not only be caused by DM, but by something as simple as Calcinosis Circumscripta, which Casey James has (scares the beejeebies out of me). If a calcification blocks the nerve pathways, the nerve cells will die off. I hate when the term DM or CDRM is thrown around loosely, without a complete set of diagnostics. Its unfair to the dog and could cause potentially life saving treatment to not even be considered.  There are too many conditions to even begin to list that will present in the exact same manner as DM.  In ALS the EMG is affected early in the disease. In DM in GSDS, the EMG is normal.

I also have to add that GME is a very real possibility of the cause of paralysis in younger dogs.  It can be brought on by vaccinations and I suspect that is what has happened with very young dogs developing *DM*. Again, unless ALL diagnostic tests are run, one cannot be SURE exactly what disease they are dealing with, when it comes to rear end weakness :(

In my area though all those tests are very cost prohibitive...So. Cal.  You cannot even walk into a specialty vet hospital without them charging you $5,000 for an emergency call and they quoted my friend with a dog that bloated $10,000.  Wished they would get real and our diagnosis process could be a whole lot better than it is now.  So with those type costs they will be getting fewer and fewer people willing to bring in dogs that could have other issues.  The local vets just do not have the experience or staff to handle major illnesses with the big guys particularly.  Its even more if you walk in with a GSD.  Discusting but true.  Nan

Oh, I know, Nans! CJ's Ct Scan this week cost $1600!!!  I figure he is my $30,000 GSD. Between the xrays, original CT scan, the original surgery to remove the calcinosis circumscripta, then the two elbow surgeries, follow up care, and the recent CT scan. Well, no, its certainly not cheap to deal with health problems or diagnose them :(

The DM Flash Test had the exact same efficacy as all the more expensive tests, but everyone running to do the OFA DM DNA test, instead of the DM Flash Testt put the DM  Flash Test out of business :( Lets see- $65 vs thousands in expensive tests...  :( It would have been worth keeping just for diagnostics, alone!

That's good to know Marjorie.

I have to say though all of this is mind boggling! Sounds like some Vets are sure taking advantage of those that love their dogs...

I went 30 + years and never had a case of bloat and then had 2 in less than 4 months. lost one and saved one. and it was sure a lot less than what Nans said. That would have given me heart attack on the spot!

So far, I have been lucky and haven't had to deal with DM and what all that entails. I hope it stays that way.