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by hexe on 17 May 2013 - 01:05
Sita's Mom, you mean to tell me that the SV Zeitung wouldn't print a lovely advertisement thanking the breeder for sending the OP two dear, sweet family members? And of course, such a 'thank you' ad would have to have some photos of the darlings! As the saying goes, 'a picture is worth a thousand words'. No 'free speech' involved, since there really wouldn't need to be much 'speech' in the ad.
by tedebear12 on 17 May 2013 - 01:05
Thank you to everyone for caring and for your ideas thus far. I will go read the rules about giving the breeder's name before I do it. I don't want to abuse any type of rules, and I also don't mean for it to be a bashing needlessly. I can prove it. I took photos of my puppy's tail when he was very little, and it was L shaped to give him an idea. Several months later I took photos of his cowhocked rear and increasingly curled tail, and then most recently I gave him a photo of his current tail at about a year old. The tail changed shape as he matured and the bones hardened. I thought as a breeder he would want to know about the tail and other stuff, and for quite some time, I actually believed he had accidentally done it to me. Then I realized that wasn't true, and I was giving him too much credit.
He is a well known German breeder, and he sells dogs all over the world. The mother of the puppies was recently sold to Mexico. The sire has produced many puppies.
No, there was no contract, and I knew that. I understood that there were no implied warranties. My fault on that end, but I've had contracts, and still had issues too. For me, I keep the dogs, even if they aren't what I was planning for. I just create a new plan for that dog. Even though there was no guarantee, I didn't expect dishonesty and total lack of care. Even if you don't take into account my puppy's bad ear or his mouth issues at all, his tail and rear are very much genetic and cannot under any circumstances be blamed on me. He did tell me the ears were my fault. I can tell you they are soft ears. I did tape them many times, but I'm not going to tape for the life of a dog.
I think in the end I trusted him because I wanted to, and these dogs are related to my oldest dog, which came from him as well. I guess I thought that meant something.
I will send a note to the SV and hope something comes of it. I will try to post photos of his tail and rear so you can see that these are easily visible faults. In spite of all of that, I love this dog and his sister so much! Their personalities are wonderful.
Thank you again!
He is a well known German breeder, and he sells dogs all over the world. The mother of the puppies was recently sold to Mexico. The sire has produced many puppies.
No, there was no contract, and I knew that. I understood that there were no implied warranties. My fault on that end, but I've had contracts, and still had issues too. For me, I keep the dogs, even if they aren't what I was planning for. I just create a new plan for that dog. Even though there was no guarantee, I didn't expect dishonesty and total lack of care. Even if you don't take into account my puppy's bad ear or his mouth issues at all, his tail and rear are very much genetic and cannot under any circumstances be blamed on me. He did tell me the ears were my fault. I can tell you they are soft ears. I did tape them many times, but I'm not going to tape for the life of a dog.
I think in the end I trusted him because I wanted to, and these dogs are related to my oldest dog, which came from him as well. I guess I thought that meant something.
I will send a note to the SV and hope something comes of it. I will try to post photos of his tail and rear so you can see that these are easily visible faults. In spite of all of that, I love this dog and his sister so much! Their personalities are wonderful.
Thank you again!
by hexe on 17 May 2013 - 01:05
tedebear12, I wouldn't count your young male out as far as doing agility just yet--granted, he probably won't be the fastest dog on the course, but the GSDs rarely are anyway, and I think you'll find that he can only benefit, physically, from the conditioning he'll get from the activity. Glad to hear that you love them both despite the issues, and that they are home forever. 
by Hundmutter on 17 May 2013 - 04:05
SM - Let's not confuse issues here; I don't think it's a 'free speech'
matter, I think it would be more a case of 'editorial policy' by the SV for
Zeitung to decide whether or or not to carry such an advert or article
exposing a German breeder. Nothing to stop the OP enquiring though,
most magazines rely on the income they get from advertisers, and it
would be a novel change from dog food, sports equipment and dog
trailers !
matter, I think it would be more a case of 'editorial policy' by the SV for
Zeitung to decide whether or or not to carry such an advert or article
exposing a German breeder. Nothing to stop the OP enquiring though,
most magazines rely on the income they get from advertisers, and it
would be a novel change from dog food, sports equipment and dog
trailers !
by kyto on 17 May 2013 - 04:05
sv will always protect their own breeders/members, i keep repeating this unless you can go pick up your dog/puppy yourself don't import them, us breeders have more than enough breeding males/females and frozen seemen is availeble if necessary
your dogs aren't less than any german political titled overpriced importdog but as long as you keep playing sv/wusv moneymaking games and keep believing in their political titles these things will keep on happening
your dogs aren't less than any german political titled overpriced importdog but as long as you keep playing sv/wusv moneymaking games and keep believing in their political titles these things will keep on happening
by cathy d on 17 May 2013 - 09:05
When you buy puppies from Germany, they do not come with any guarantees. Sorry you feel like you've been taken, but puppies are a crap shoot at best. Even in America you are unlikely to receive compensation because no breeder that I know of guarantees tail or ear set. Did the explicitly breeder promise erect ears and a good tail set? Did you ask for these things before purchase? If not, he doesn't owe you anything. And demanding such makes you look like a newbie.
Even human doctors can't guarantee perfect babies so you certainly can't expect it from a breeder.
If you absolutely must have a certain look or temperament, then it's best to get an older, more developed dog and be prepared to spend the higher dollar cost for a known quality.
If you had gone thru a broker, the broker might have been able to mediate for you but you took all the risk to save the dollars and buy puppies and this time you "lost". This is the world of dogs. It's not all cotten candy and lollipops. At least it is superficial qualities you are complaining about, not severe or fatal disease.
Is there nothing about the dogs you like? Enjoy your dogs for what they are or place them in another home where they will be loved and appreciated and move on.
Even human doctors can't guarantee perfect babies so you certainly can't expect it from a breeder.
If you absolutely must have a certain look or temperament, then it's best to get an older, more developed dog and be prepared to spend the higher dollar cost for a known quality.
If you had gone thru a broker, the broker might have been able to mediate for you but you took all the risk to save the dollars and buy puppies and this time you "lost". This is the world of dogs. It's not all cotten candy and lollipops. At least it is superficial qualities you are complaining about, not severe or fatal disease.
Is there nothing about the dogs you like? Enjoy your dogs for what they are or place them in another home where they will be loved and appreciated and move on.
by Abby Normal on 17 May 2013 - 15:05
cathy d
OP has stated that the dogs are loved and will be kept forever despite the problems. An ankylosed tail is completely different to a 'poor tail set' ! Especially when it seems it was very apparent at the point of sale.
tedebear12 I would definitely make your complaint, though I doubt that much will come of it. You sound the sort of person that will make the best of what you have and give your dogs a great life. That's integrity.
OP has stated that the dogs are loved and will be kept forever despite the problems. An ankylosed tail is completely different to a 'poor tail set' ! Especially when it seems it was very apparent at the point of sale.
tedebear12 I would definitely make your complaint, though I doubt that much will come of it. You sound the sort of person that will make the best of what you have and give your dogs a great life. That's integrity.
by tedebear12 on 17 May 2013 - 17:05
Thank you Abby for your comments!
Cathy...Yes, this is not about poor ears and tail set. I know there are no guarantees, and I'm not expecting it. I do expect honesty and integrity and standing behind that. Those are 2 different things. I am not a newbie to the breed by any means. Additionally, I have known breeders that do refund money when ears don't come up. It depends on the breeder. Also, I don't know if you read about my puppy's mouth problems and the 2 surgeries and 1 CT scan. That is a pretty serious issue, and it's not done yet.
I didn't work with a broker or anyone else because I have an older dog from the same breeder. These puppies are closely related to her through the generations. That was the motivation to get them. Yes, of course, there are nice dogs in the US, but not these lines to her...or not that I could find.
I have read the terms of service, and I don't believe I would be breaching them at all by posting my dog's name, his sire and dam's names, and breeder along with photos. I am not telling you to not purchase from this breeder or breed to this dog or to get a dog related to this. I'm just telling you to be aware of what can run in the pedigree line and take into account my experience. Please note for those that haven't noticed, I love this dog immensely. He is incredible special to me, flaws and all.
He is gorgeous to me no matter what, and I am not ashamed of him. I will show him in performance events that he can do, so he will not be hidden away.
His name is Kody vom Altenberger Land
Sire: Canyon von der Lars-Aue
Dam: Ellis von der Villa Musica
Breeder, if you haven't guessed: Norbert Schleuter
Tail at 12 weeks of age. Note the L shape of it. There are actually two knotty spots in the tail with fused bones. One is at the first bend, and one is towards the end of the tail.
Tail at about 9 months of age. I know I have another earlier photo but this photo and the next one clearly show how the tail has corkscrewed as the bones hardened and he got older. This is what it looks like today. This also shows his rear.
What he looks like from the side.
Isn't he such a handsome boy?
Again, this isn't about how special my boy and his sister are to me because there is no comparison. This is about letting people know what runs in lines and breeder integrity. I think it's important that everyone understands what is in a pedigree so there aren't surprises. Puppies like mine are often hidden or gotten rid of, but I am not going to hide him.
Cathy...Yes, this is not about poor ears and tail set. I know there are no guarantees, and I'm not expecting it. I do expect honesty and integrity and standing behind that. Those are 2 different things. I am not a newbie to the breed by any means. Additionally, I have known breeders that do refund money when ears don't come up. It depends on the breeder. Also, I don't know if you read about my puppy's mouth problems and the 2 surgeries and 1 CT scan. That is a pretty serious issue, and it's not done yet.
I didn't work with a broker or anyone else because I have an older dog from the same breeder. These puppies are closely related to her through the generations. That was the motivation to get them. Yes, of course, there are nice dogs in the US, but not these lines to her...or not that I could find.
I have read the terms of service, and I don't believe I would be breaching them at all by posting my dog's name, his sire and dam's names, and breeder along with photos. I am not telling you to not purchase from this breeder or breed to this dog or to get a dog related to this. I'm just telling you to be aware of what can run in the pedigree line and take into account my experience. Please note for those that haven't noticed, I love this dog immensely. He is incredible special to me, flaws and all.
He is gorgeous to me no matter what, and I am not ashamed of him. I will show him in performance events that he can do, so he will not be hidden away.
His name is Kody vom Altenberger Land
Sire: Canyon von der Lars-Aue
Dam: Ellis von der Villa Musica
Breeder, if you haven't guessed: Norbert Schleuter
Tail at 12 weeks of age. Note the L shape of it. There are actually two knotty spots in the tail with fused bones. One is at the first bend, and one is towards the end of the tail. Tail at about 9 months of age. I know I have another earlier photo but this photo and the next one clearly show how the tail has corkscrewed as the bones hardened and he got older. This is what it looks like today. This also shows his rear. What he looks like from the side. Isn't he such a handsome boy?Again, this isn't about how special my boy and his sister are to me because there is no comparison. This is about letting people know what runs in lines and breeder integrity. I think it's important that everyone understands what is in a pedigree so there aren't surprises. Puppies like mine are often hidden or gotten rid of, but I am not going to hide him.
by Hundmutter on 17 May 2013 - 17:05
Tedebear, can I thank you for your honesty ? More
owners should recognise problems with their dogs
and tell us all about them, for the reason you state:
letting people know what runs in lines. JMO.
I reckon you are brave and I am glad you still
cherish the dog even though he did not turn out
like you hoped.
owners should recognise problems with their dogs
and tell us all about them, for the reason you state:
letting people know what runs in lines. JMO.
I reckon you are brave and I am glad you still
cherish the dog even though he did not turn out
like you hoped.
by tedebear12 on 17 May 2013 - 17:05
Hundmutter: THANK YOU! I'm glad you see why I want to share this information with everyone.
For everyone, I have informed the breeder of this posting. It is up to him as to whether he responds. I have also decided to add my dog's pedigree and photo to the pedigree listings along with extra comments to explain so that any time anyone researches that pedigree, my beautiful boy can be found too. : )
For everyone, I have informed the breeder of this posting. It is up to him as to whether he responds. I have also decided to add my dog's pedigree and photo to the pedigree listings along with extra comments to explain so that any time anyone researches that pedigree, my beautiful boy can be found too. : )
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