Why do people not educate on breeding and ownership of dogs? - Page 3

Great post Abby! Bcrawford, Have you followed up with these people? Sounds like this poor pup needs an advocate and these people need someone to guide them. They obviously haven't taken the initiative themselves to find out what it means to properly care for a pup. If a person can read, there is plenty of info out there on how to care for a puppy. What a shame for this poor little pup.

Abby,

Before you shoot the messenger, jump off your high horse and read the title. I did not blame the breeder. I do not know the breeder nor do I want to. I spent a lot more time describing where the current state is than I did when the dog was purchased. The title reads "Why do people not educate on breeding and ownership of dogs?" .. That covers both sides in my oppinion.

This was a open discussion and not a targeted attack.

Thank you,
Brandon

Hi Jenni,

I apologize for the delay but I've been out West on business trip. If you have never been to San Francisco -- your not missing much.

Anyways, after going back and looking at your replies to posts it seems most of them are flippant or usually a jump on when someone interjects their "solution".. Since you are used to that type I reply I would not expect much more from a PBT fancier. ;)

The part I left out was that when I asked which vet the owner was taking the dog to I called their office to find out and suggest a few things... Come to find out they are closed on Friday's.

I had a heart to heart with the owner later the weekend after I posted my rant and we have a understanding where things should be.

Hey Brandon

I was responding to what you actually said in the post, the 'title' seems less important than the actual content, and it was somewhat ambiguous in any case.

Certainly sounded like you were blaming the breeder, it seemed quite clear:
My reason for blowing a fuse over it is that why would a breeder sell a dog like this and why would someone buy her?

It also sounded like you were ducking out of actually telling them what they needed to hear:

My first reaction was go off on learning about caring for a dog, get her medical care and while you’re at it. Have her fixed! Instead I said just remember the Lixotinic. If it had been people that I did not like or work with I would have.

Yes it's an open discussion, and you got my view. It wasn't a targeted attack, though obviously it wasn't what you wanted to hear. Good for you for finally telling them what they needed to hear.

Abby,

You have to excuse my lack of ability to properly project my actual tone when in text. So I will go ahead and say I'm not trying to be combative.

However, I see you highlighted some of my post and you typed "I was responding to what you actually said in the post, the 'title' seems less important than the actual content, and it was somewhat ambiguous in any case." I'm having a hard time understanding how you determine there was some ambiguity in my post.

Moving on it leads me to ask you a question. Would you sell a puppy to a buyer with shady record keeping? Would you sell a puppy to a buyer that you as the breeder did not address the rear dew claw issue? And maybe it is my fault for not going in to immaculate detail when I made the post however, I was shown a picture or two of the pup when it was several months old and it was in poor looking shape while still in the breeders care. All while knowing they plan to breed her to a male that is not even AKC (which yes I know all about being pure bread does not mean well bread -- just trust me on my personal evaluation).. All while trying to dance around trying to explain the issues I see to a person who is not only a co-worker but in a position that I am the manager of. It gets sticky.

Again - I'm not arguing with you but I feel like you jumped the gun on what I was trying to say.

Brandon

Brandon
The ambiguity for me in the title is this - Why do people not educate on breeding and ownership of dogs? (what people specifically? - educate who? themselves? others? - breeders educate prospective owners?).

I highlighted those portions of your text to show you what led me to my view on what you had said. From what you now say, it seems that you missed out the most important elements from your original post, those that you are coming back with now. It's not really a case of jumping the gun if you miss out information, we can only comment (and you asked for comment by posting) on what you put in your original post. I don't think it's a case of going into 'immaculate' detail, but 'relevant' detail.

Previously you said an 'acquaintance' of yours, now you say it is a co-worker and you are their manager.That's very different!  That certainly led me to suppose that you walked away from someone you were not likely to see very often, leaving the dog in poor condition and no prospect of vet care, and no useful advice from you.

Now you say they have 'shady record keeping' - what, of puppies/dogs previously? Would the breeder know that, I doubt it's the sort of information a puppy buyer is going to volunteer? I can tell you that I wish there was a central list of people with 'histories' of poor dog ownership/animal abuse, but here in the UK, there isn't. Don't know about in the USA.

To answer your question, no I wouldn't sell a puppy to people like that and I don't think the breeder sounds reputable, but neither do I think that you can blame the current state of a dog at 8 months old on the breeder. What is 'several' months - 3? 4?. Again, that's relevant detail, as to how long your friends had been caring for it.  The breeder may have still had it at several months, being 12 weeks. I am not trying to be argumentative either. Just clear on why I have my view, which has not changed greatly, unless they had only had the dog a few weeks. I've seen rescue dogs in condition that we didn't even know that they would survive turn around completely in 6 weeks when well cared for. As Starcharr said, these people clearly need a mentor, and it looks like you are it. The important thing is to not give them any justification, however minor, to shift any blame for the dogs condition to the breeder or it's breeding, but to take responsibility themselves. I don't care how 'poorly' bred a dog is, it's overall condition is down to how it is cared for.

A simple answer to the question in your title is that they are to lazy and or stupid to do it.  The internet provides a treasure trove of information available for anyone who cares to look it up.

I'd just like to very much support what Abby said in her last post;  these are 'holes'
in the information you'd provided in the OP which I'd noticed too, and the longer
this conversation continued the more complex the situation seems.  While I do
sympathise with you Brandon in that it probably was difficult in those circumstances
to raise your concerns about this dog with her owners,  that isn't to say you were right not to spell out more of the situation at the start.  [You could still do that without identifying people.]   "A rod for your own back", so to speak.
If you want serious comments from this board, you don't tell only half the story.
We can only respond on the basis of how much  information you let us have.

Oh, come on. Of course Bcrawford is 100% right, our reactions to his post had nothing to do with the fact that he did nothing about a dog in bad condition, changed and continues to change his story, and everything to do with the fact that I apparently fancy "PBTs", whatever they are. Peanut butter and tuna sandwiches?  What were we thinking voicing our opinions on a discussion board?  Mea culpa. 

Who cares who is to blame? Jump in and do something about it. Don't just point the finger and try to make yourself sound like a hero, while politely tiptoeing around social mores. 

I don't think the same politics apply to animal situations as "regular" situations. Animals have no voice; you have to speak up for them, regardless of the potential for conflict, imnsho. Just yesterday, a stray GSD was brought to me. She had bad skin and dirty teeth for her age. I could tell she was quite young. No microchip, no tags. I called the police and a couple hours later, I got a call from the owner. When he picked her up, I was nice but I pointed out how lucky she was that I had her and not someone who would have kept her, dumped her at animal control, sold her to someone on CL for a quick buck, etc. I asked him what he was going to do to ensure that she would never be lost and unidentifiable again and asked why she wasn't chipped since he had no tags. He confessed that he meant to, but the vet wanted over $200 to do so when you add in the exam fee, etc. and he was short on cash. So, I chipped her on my porch before she left, told him to feed her better food, especially if he doesn't have a lot of money for vet visits, and sent the dog off a lot better off than she was before she got lost that day. The guy was very receptive and thankful. I guess if I wasn't such a rude person, I would've kept my mouth shut and crossed my fingers she would never get out again, but I can't help my lack of tact when a dog's safety is on the line.