Brindle Gsd! Did Not Think This Was Possible! - Page 10

Poor Molly, you didn't get that they made a distinction between Eastern and Western as species. See, the DEP doesn't want to admit they exist because then they would have to protect them. The Western ones (in South Dakota) are plentiful and not protected. They did DNA and it was not released, that's a fact. MY POINT was just because YOU call them extinct (and there is a rule to follow there, and yet things like the Java Rhino show up any way, someone forgot to tell them they were extinct!) it is hard to deny that to a person staring into the eyes of a mountain lion, yes! in CT.

Just like a person staring at extinct brindle markings on a purebred GSD. Hard to believe they are extinct. Maybe the original ones are,  like I said, but what the heck will you call those markings on GSD that sure look like brindle?

Molly, if your hypothesis of extinction of brindle would be correct, in what generation you suggest there need to be a dutchy in there to have caused that? Besides doesnt that suggest as well a dominant brindle gene?

There is also the fact that anyone with two eyeballs, that knows anything about what a purebred GSD looks like, can tell that these dogs pictured - brindle or not (but that is an obvious sign) are not purebred GSDs.  Obviously they are mixed breed dogs, brindle or not brindle.  In fact they  look much like a ..... wait for it...... Dutch Shepherd mixed with GSD!!!!  Go figure, how could that possibly happen?

I would think that the dutchie (or other brindle-colored breed) wouldn't be too far away in the pedigree to produce brindle. 

So everybody else is a liar, I get it! So what do you think about that dominant Black strain of Russian GSD? Are they considered imposters, because surely that case is suspect?

See, I've spent some "reverse" time on the pedigrees, tracking backward and one just never knows, seems to me there is wiggle room. Not that I finished what I started yet, but hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

then get on board with this honest breeder and start producing purebred brindle, cream-colored, merle and panda GSDs!  all of course with akc registration, and proven dna tested parents!!!!  You could make a fortune selling pups to people who don't know a mixed breed when they see one.

Oh please, I'm not the money-grubbing , conniving sort like eh, um, hmmm.

What I do think would be interesting to know is, if BRINDLE is also a pattern and not just a color. And if it is, as a pattern seen all over like in a Dutchie, then perhaps it can be proved in this day and age. Since, if it were not like Black in GSD, which is also a pattern, if I understand what Pod has written, then maybe there is a difference in the GSD brindle as well, extinct or not.

The known forms of brindle are dominant and on the K locus and if the brindle gene or dominant black gene are present, then the A locus genes (which gives us the GSD patterns of sable, black-tan, and recessive black) are overruled. The brindle gene affects all red/tan/brown  (phaeomelanin) areas--so a recessive black dog could theoretically pass on the brindle gene without being brindle itself.

This web page gives a very good explanation: http://abnormality.purpleflowers.net/genetics/brindle.htm

It is remotely possible that there is a mutation for a recessive brindle, much like the Panda gene for white areas is a dominant mutation (the normal piebald gene is recessive). The odds against this happening and being unknown to genetic researchers are very high.

Christine

Thanks for the link, Christine! Interesting reading. So there is actual a difference in a^y and a^w? And if I understood it right it only takes one brindle gene to express itself. So, if the brindle expresses itself only in the red parts of the dogthen it could be possible passed down a line. I wonder now if our black sables actual do have brindle expressed, and we just overlook it as one tends to look more for the better known thin dark stripes.

If brindle is such dominant gene, how could it have become extinct in the GSD?

It's easiest to extinguish a dominant gene--like brindle or merle--you just don't breed to a dog with those features. For example, that's why there were almost no sable show dogs (and to get the sable color back, a breeder bred out to a workingline dog to produce Timo) until a few years ago (and there are still very few).

For example, if I don't ever want any sable puppies, I just never breed to or from a sable dog. If I don't want any black puppies, I have to avoid a great deal more colors to avoid the chance of getting black puppies--I'd have to avoid all but the lighter saddle-back pups and sables--and even then, I might get a black puppy.