Ethics - Page 2

errrr I accidently pressed a key, which ended up posting ahead! Anyhow... you know what the bible says about porking your sister? DON'T! Breeding 2 dogs that are litter mates is quite disgusting and I don't know why people do it.

I would imagine that the breeding was accidental and the breeder decided to sell the pups rather than get rid of them. A friend's GSD bitch was mated by her own father (about 10 years ago) so he "dispatched" the puppies at birth. He was not prepared to wait and see if the pups had serious defects and tightened his security with the dogs. The vet who came to check the dam was horrified and said he should have found homes for the pups. I am sure most of us could tell a story or two about similar events! Patrishap, - it is a great shame that you had such a bad experience with this pup. How old was it when you decided to return it to the breeder, and do you know what happened to it eventually? I think as far as ethics go, a) the pup should not have been sold as a quality pedigree in the first place, b) the breeder should have been more amenable to an acceptable settlement. It would be interesting to hear the breeder's side of this story.......

Sometimes an in-breeding like this is born out of total ignorance, other times it is just for the love of money. I once saw an ad posted on a telephone pole for "Purebred AKC German Shepherd pups..." I called out of simple curiosity and found out that the pups were born out of brother/sister, neither of whom had hips tested ("oh..I know the hips are good, I can tell just by looking"!!) Anyway, I gave my opinion, not that it mattered, for all of the pups were sold at that point to equally ignorant and unsuspecting people. Ultimately, who to blame? I think the AKC bears most of the responsibility for this. They have all the info at their fingertips, and yet still allow a breeding like this to be registered. So many people place importance and value on the fact that pups are "AKC registered", and if they knew the whole story- would soon realize that the registration is not worth the paper it is drawn on, as far as assuring that they will have a quality dog. If AKC ever put health and careful breeding ahead of the almighty $$$- then MAYBE some of these BYB people would cease to exist.

I don't know enough specific about genetics to say why anything happens unfortunately - and I don't think the genetics experts know either!!!! But I do know that it is very common for the hips to differ....some slightly,some drastically. A friend bought a 5 year old bitch from Denmark who was floating around the STates for a few years with "C" hips - one was 'B', the other 'C'. The dog went OFA Good at 5+ years old. Another freind had a very good highline female done and one hip was excellent, the other very bad. So her overall rating followed the worse hip. I just helped him network her into a pet home here locally. I think it is common for body parts to be slightly different...lots of people have a foot or a finger which is a tad bigger/smaller than the other side. Dogs are not any different.

patrishap, I really can not answer that, mother nature works in mysterious ways

I was watching a program on TV where the Doctor was a plastic surgon and he was fix this lady that had two different size breasts,do know why that would happen but I guess it does...

Brittany,What does the bible say about porking ones sister?

Hey Kougar This is Jill........Period and The German People are highly honest if you have good contacts so stop knocking them now! I do not know where you come from man but get a life, anybody knows u breed closer than 2 and that is close might as well breed daughte to father, the Germans were wrong in telling us to not go lower than number 3??? NOT!! HD can slip through any line from far back, I try to research the entire pedigree before buying and so does my German friends. So far, so good!!! I have no problem with HD or anything else. If you breed anything lower then fair and that is low your asking for trouble, but you sound like you enjoy it.?? At least we go to the expense of OFA hips and elbows, check the hearts, thyroids, bleeders, liver, etc, many do not, but it does not guarantee me 100% or am I bragging, just do it as an ethical Breeder, Breed either SV West German Dogs to sell and not lie or Just Breed for the money any old thing. Do not care what u feed your dogs, do not care if u worm them or give them shots, do not care if they are ever brushed, do not care if you have any dignity left as a so called Breeder, then wonder why u have to almost give puppies away?? Be honest and it will follow and pay off.........period. Spend money to take care of your Breeding dogs and forget about paying the bills with dogs. Jill

On close breedings, and in-breedings 2-1, 2-2 etc. It is done in the breeding of many creatures. Go to this web site, producers of TOP Show Betta stock. http://www.bcbetta.com/stock.html Almost every male is sold with a sibling female, and most spawns are produced from paired siblings. In this world, the outcrossing is disgusting, and those who do it sometimes get just as flamed as those who do the opposite elsewere. Best Wishes, Jo-Ann

Jill - or wildthing - your comments do not make any sense. you posted ad for "mommys boy" shreckenhaus kennel in kittanning pa area...advertising male on this site is selling pet puppies from untitled dogs. First saw this site over a year ago, using male less than 2 years old for stud, and advertising in Pittsburgh papers for pets every time I looked. Using untitled male because the German contacts were selling this kennel dogs with no titles and praising AKC. Lady who told me this was Pat Shreckengrost, sp?, owner of that kennel. If you are not her, why are you advertising her kennel as if it were yours? This person said they had never seen a schutzhund training session or trial, but is breeding and selling dogs on credentials of grandparents. FYI - the dams of my 3 litters here are KKL1 bitches. My next is from Schh3 - HOT since 16 weeks old - KKL1 bitch, and sire is imported V Schh3, KKL1. Hips have to be done for KKL1 BTW. Look up dogs on www.offa.org to see hip status. Can you say this about all your litters????