GSD - Soft Ears Should Not Be Bred - Page 5

bz

 I guess we agree completely then.  Taping will only affect the cartilage very minimally at this point.  But it might be enough to give it that little extra to be fairly erect.  I have done this for GSDs also.  And for the GSD "I personally" prefer the forms.  It keeps the ears in the more natural stance for a GSD.  Plus it also has the added advantage of not stripping the hair off the back side of the ear. (when the tape is pulled even with an adhesive remover you will still remove some hair) As well as that the ear is open to the air and less chance of ear infections as can happen when you post the ears.

The old timers, really old timers that is, used to cut old photographs into the right shape and glue it inside the ear using non-flexible collodion. It worked very fast, a few days. The collodion was very flammable, not sure if it's still available.

I agree with whoever said soft ears should not be breed...NO need to tape ears of any german shepherd . No one in my breeding group of gsd have ever taped an ear...

We do not breed dobermans or any othe dog whose ears are cut to make them stand..a german shepherd naturally has a standing ear and the pup does it on its own..if good quality and good environment and good nutrition are a part of the line that is bred..yes,you must look  back to the line and see what is passed down...I laugh at pups I bred whose ears were straight at 4 and 5 weeks old...looked funny sometime to see ears bigger than they were..  then I had several of the larger headed , bigger boned males whose ears took till 8 months old to both stand perfectly beautiful..

just let the cartilage build its strength with the raw meat and raw bone menu you can incorporate into your feeding program.

All responses to my question make sense.  Sorry OP if this took from your post.

Yellow, gad to hear you never had this problem, but believe me, there are well bred German Shepherds with floppy ears  - and there are dogs with floppy ears out of dogs with formerly taped ears.
Thank you rtd for claryfying the difference between a German Shepherd ear and a Doberman ear. The shape and cartiledge are totally different. I have seen several dogs ears messed up because people didn´t know about the procedure ( and I have seen a lot of puppies with taped ears only because people weren´t willing to wait, too ).
 

Without question, soft ears are a fault and it's a disappointment when one or both ears never stand. I've not heard of any European breeder that offers any sort of warranty, save for the occassional provision for hip and elbow soundness; I know of people here in the States who have authentic personal friendships with one or more European breeders, and I'm sure something gets worked out between them should one get a pup from the other which develops a fault that would disqualify it from getting a show rating and passing breed survey, but for the rest of the world, you take your chances when you purchase a puppy from ANYONE. I'm with BHaugh, and then some--I won't pay more than US$2000.00 for ANY DOG, regardless of age, titles, etc. Living creatures are just that: living things that are subject to sudden death, career-ending injuries, or just plain failure to develop as hoped. These are not the hallmarks of a good financial investment, and I'm not independently wealthy with a fat, lifetime inheritance awaiting me.

Couple of things, though, that I noticed, Cowboy:

a. This pup is too fat now, and from the photos it seems she has been all along, even back in the photo where the pretty woman is holding her in front of the heart-decorated window or door. That certainly doesn't help matters, though her ears do appear to be coming up nice and strong in the three earliest photos of her. [Edited to add: She's also a heavy-boned pup, and it's not at all uncommon for dogs with that amount of bone to be slow with the ears finally stabilizing. And also, regarding the weight issue: don't be stunned if she goes through one or more episodes of panosteitis, either. It's common enough in the heavier-framed pups to begin with, and anything that overly accelerates their physical development like over-feeding or feeding too rich a diet, just serves to up the ante for the condition. It's a self-limiting problem, usually, though repeated episodes will leave scarring on the affected bone, but worst of all is having to see your pup in pain and not really being able to do much about it save for some anti-inflamatory support and activity restriction to the level of cage rest unless being walked for bathroom breaks. Tough to do with a drivey puppy.]

b. Her ear leather may be too soft, but her ears most certainly aren't too big, nor does the leather appear to be too thick. If anything, the ear leather might be considered to be on the thin side, which creates a weaker base to support the pinna. But they are a nice, attractive size and appear to be set well.

c. In the two photos @ 9 months, that left ear is standing quite nicely with the small piece of moleskin support--were this my pup, I wouldn't have given up shortly thereafter; yes, she probably does have softer ears than one would ever want, and no, she should never been considered as a breeding candidate, but yeah, I'd rather see that left ear standing just because. I agree with Susie re that initial taping job--it is actually easier than one might think to create an unintended and unwanted crease in the cartilage while the dog is still developing, and it takes that much longer of conditioning the ear to stand with the aid of some degree of artificial support. I think you should go back to that small moleskin brace, and for at least the next 6 months I wouldn't have her be without it for more than a day or two as needed to keep the skin intact and healthy.  Consider the situation to be akin to ear-gauging in humans: we were never meant to have holes in our ear lobes four inches in diameter, but if you start out with a smaller hole and then gradually keep stretching that hole with something one increment larger, eventually you're able to be your own carnival act by letting people toss ping-pong balls through the gauge in your ear lobe, three balls for a dollar, to try and win a ten-cent gegaw. It's a matter of training not just the cartilage to take the desired shape, but also the muscles that have to support that cartilage so they do their job as well.

d. Genetics are the ultimate casino game; as you can see looking at her photo pedigree, the dogs she springs from don't have incorrect ear carriage, and that's to be expected since they had to meet the SV standards in order to have registerable offspring. It's possible--likely--that at least a few of them have a sibling or two with ears that were too soft and didn't stand, so the genetics that affect this are undoubtedly in the bloodlines...But the genetics for that trait are present in ALL of the bloodlines, really, so it becomes a baby/bathwater situation. Eventually any given mating will produce one or more offspring who phenotypically display the trait when the spin of the genetic wheel lands on the genetic combination responsible for the development of soft ears in a fetal pup--but if the pairing of those same dogs has produced twenty pups with perfect ears, and just three with a soft ear, yet all twenty-three pups are healthy, physically and temperamentally sound and stable with the ability to participate in the activities their owners seek with them, is it really fair and accurate that claim that this breeding should never have been done?  I would argue that is it not a reasonable stance to take.

I agree soft ears ,just like, hernias and many other faults can crop up but the point is...donot breed the one with it...I saw an ad yesterday in classified for a litter of well bred pups that had a BLUE SABLE listed for 1,500.00 just along side the rest of his littermates for same price..open registration...a pet peeve also..do not breed a blue , liver or chocolate gsd..stop at that point..no where did I indicate do not do the breeding over...yes , you can have another litter and never see another one of the faults ever again...JUST do not BREED the one with the fault..

Ears probably would have gone up if many would have WAITED>.and done the nutrition thing...but if you fool with it and it AINT broke , you get a worse fault and will never know if it would have gone up on its own..I have seen big males and females wait a whole 12 months and then beautiful as can be...some take a lot of months of the dog getting his act together and holding them up..you can do things like  meow, or make strange noises to make the dog PERK them and it will eventually grow stronger especially if you add GELATIN to the diet and raw bones and raw meat...make the dog chew for a long time and do not let other pups chew or naw on the pups ears...that are having a problem

a slender pup also as a slender German shepherd is the way to keeping your pet healthy also.

Thanks All

Hexe - I'll take your advice and continue to support that ear a little longer. I've got nothing to lose and your conclusions make a lot of sense...thank you

Cowboy

YR, I wasn't replying to anything you'd said.

I just was making sure...I try to make things REAL clear...

YR