Chance to Own a Quenn Son....Do I take it? - Page 4

People sell dogs for a reason. You need to find out why, the real reason.

Yes and just because he sired litters in the past doesn't mean he is still fertile, that's what happened to me with my Quenn son, he had sired litters in Europe, but when I got him he was shooting blanks!

misery does love company. I thought I was the only one with stories like these.

Paul said a mouth full. Dogs are for sale for a reason. A lot of the reasons may not be an issue for the buyer, but the buyer should spend whatever extra it takes to make certain it is not an issue for them.

 

I agree that people sell dogs for a reason, and often they lie about those reasons.  I am also confident that this person is selling the dog for the reasons that he says, not because there is necessarily anything wrong with him.  I have trained/sold/bartered/etc dogs in the past.  I have trained assistance dog for the disabled, put over 500 hours in those dogs(no, I am not new to the dog training business, but I do not train Schutzhund), and don't get what this guy would LIKE to get for this dog.  That is the basis I am going to go on.  I like the dog.  I can see potential in him as a demo/working dog for me.  My last service dog passed away in Sept of last year from cancer at a young age.  I cannot seem to find the replacement dog for her just yet, and will like breed a litter of pups to raise one to replace her(not a GSD---remember not my first choice in breeds, but rather my second choice).  I think that this dog will make a nice demo dog, if the price is right, but as I have said, and other have said, nice dogs are a dime a dozen right now....so, it boils down to what am I willing to pay for the dog, and what is the man willing to take.
Thanks to everyone for their imput, it has been appreciated....the private messages as well---thanks for those.

I will let you all know what I and the owner decides!!

 

A stud dog is only as good as what he can produce. I had the chance some years back to buy a dog way out of my price range and was going to do the same thing as you. He wasn't titled either and I was told that he was "in training" and just needed someone to commit to it. I looked at what he had produced and most was just mediocre. I opted out of the buy. This last October had another chance to buy a titled dog, great lines, required an elbow xray to match that Excellent hip score. Guess what he didn't pass. There are always reasons why those "great" dogs are sold. Most of them are for less than stellar reasons.

Doing rescue for several years I can tell you that a great dog will NOT be sold but kept. RARELY does an owner tell you the truth when they are placing the dog because then no one would buy the dog. If the dog is 4 and hasn't passed tracking then most likely there are issues there. I would probably pass on this one. A name is only a name until that particular dog works to make it real!

Barb
 

Barb

THE DOG HAS NOT BEEN TRAINED TO TRACK.  He was purchased to be a family pet.  He was trained in PP and off leash obedience.  The owner never even registered this dog with AKC, all he has is the Export pedigree on the dog.

This owner simply never had any desire to title the dog.

Let me make sure that you understand:  I used to be in charge of a small animal control/humane society.  I was the director there for 2 yrs.  I have done rescue for years.  I have shown dogs in Obedience/conformation/etc.  I have trained dogs professionally for many years(over 30).  I have worked with pet owner for years....

Here are the excuses:
1)  Kids are allergic---yep, allergic to taking care of the dogs...mom is tired of taking care of the dog, kids are allergic to responsibility.
2)  Moving and can't take the dog with----yep, 'cause, for the most part, you are too lazy to really look for a place to where you can have the dog...
3)  Dog needs a place to run-----so, you are too lazy to give the dog the excercise that he needs.....so, he is likely being distructive.
4)  Dog is hyper----IE, you need to buckle down and pay for training, but you are too cheap  to pay for a professional to ass you with your dog.

These are just some of the reasons....and the real reasons.

I also hate it when people lie about the dogs...IE, I currently have one client who won't admit that her dog needs to come home iwth me for 8 weeks of serious rehab training----8 yr old cocka-poo that is seriously resource aggressive...and she will never fix the problem....Now, her 1 yr old Havanese is picking up the behavior now..sigh....lawsuit waiting to happen....or they will end up dumping the dogs...and they won't be truthful about it, the dogs will be adopted then bite someone, then come back...but the adopter wont tell the shelter what happened, because they know the dog will be euthanized....etc....etc....etc...

Again this dog is very nice dog, who will pass CDX with little to no work.  He will pass a BH with little to know work.  He is OFA hips/elbows.  With excellent hips.  He has awesome protection skills.  He is a kind, good dog, out of a ShIII male and bitch.  He has an owner who is getting a divorce(yep, I know this for a fact.).  I know that the owner is going to Canada for 3 months, for training for a new job.  Then he will be traveling internationally with his new job, and cannot take the dog with him.  Soon to be ex, is not very nice, and won't take the dog.

Again, I have handled this dog personally.  Nice, Nice dog.  Will I title him?  Maybe...I know of other dogs, GSDs that have been titled at 4 and 5 yrs of age....Just takes a bit of work and a good trainer....etc......

Thanks for the thoughts....

 

He sounds like the sort of dog I would like to own myself, Cliff. It sounds like you have the skill and good dog sense to take him as far as you decide he should go. Good luck!

Not saying he's a bad dog and can't title but $1500 for a stud fee is robbery.  Maybe $500 *if* he's fertile.  BH and CDX are not breed worthiness titles (but not a bad idea).  I agree there's no reason you can't title a 4 year old.  My dog is 4.5 years and we compete in various things several times a month.  I will title him until he cannot train and work anymore, but I'm not someone that titles a dog JUST to make a stud fee or to consider the dog breed worthy.  Training and competing is a lifetime commitment for us.

As most people already stated, my "concerns" would be:
4 years old, no titles, no formal training in tracking.
4 years old but did not sire a single litter. Who know what and if he will produce.
Asking $1500 stud fee for an untitled dog is too much. Personally I would think that $500 would be more reasonable in this situation.
Name is just a name, dogs produced by a certain stud will not be the same....genetics can sometimes be unpredictable.

However, CaveCliff, I think you should buy that dog for whatever price you think is fair and reasonable.
You appear to have made your own decision about the purchase, which is fine. It would be interesting to share your experience with this dog and your intentions for him in about year from now. Maybe all people here are wrong, and you will have your planed success with him.
Good luck.
 

Before you do anything  Number one:   Check his Sperm count
Make sure his Hips are still EXCELLENT,,,,ASK FOR VERIFICATION...,MAHON bought a dog from Florida ./with Pink Papers who claimed he was Sch 111,3
AND TO THIS DAYI kNO PROOF OR PAPERWORK ANY WHERE IN GERMANY CAN SHOW HE GOT A schH3

Hips change or maybe like a breeder here in  USA , hips done on another dog....back yrs ago when a database customer found a male she wanted..OH dear,  hips were dysplastic and found out that the breeder had paperwork switched....Can be DOnE

Asking us you now have some good answers,.,.BUT now you need on a 4 yr old gsd need some Health history.  DO  YOU HAVE HEALTH PAPERS AND PROOF OF HEART, BLOOD WORK AND A TRAIL OF PAPERWORK SHOWING ALL HIS SHOTS ETC?

Has he been tested for the dreaded herititary diseases we do not want carried over,..Have you checked his parentage health?
With all our answers and mine are with DOG 1, Seeofred, Mills, and the other Schh people here as well as breeders giving you some good points..,
Now you haave to build a case history on a 4 yr old male..GOOD luck and let us know all is good

I have helped two database people buy a new gsd and Nate Harves was the one who finally found a suitable gsd for the lady...BUt TESTS were all confirmed and done and still the male was full of uncomfortable problems when he got to USA

I think a 2 year old Quenn son would be more profitable and easier to find a solid candidate for fulfilling breeding and titling in the SchH world or even working titles not in SchH

jmo

Yr