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by vomeisenhaus on 07 March 2012 - 21:03
Ace952... could you tell us what "reputable breeders" of top working line dogs in europe are selling their pups for $1000 - $12000 usd including shipping? Sincerely. Kurt. You may pm me if you like.
by GSDPACK on 08 March 2012 - 00:03
There is plenty of them, vomeisenhaus... all you have to do is do a little looking around. If you know the language, you are pretty much set!
People in Czech don't do Legendary, they do breedings to a dog that will produce well with the bitch they have. Yes some had to sell a litter so they bred to the new champ, but then see how much garbage is out there out of the Legendary new winners. They brought every four legged female to them and hoped for a sale!
Just because a stud is a Legendary WUSV winner it does not mean he will produce well with a nerve basket that got its title at the midnight trail and barely passed the breed survey.
Till people learn to actually look for a dog instead for the names.... then they will pay much more for a puppy than they could if they only looked little more. I only wonder when this one particular dog I have been watching develop into a very nice animal will become the next wave of "must have a puppy out of him"...
He will be the next Legend... and the price for a puppy will go up. When it happens I let you know. I am giving it another year max!
by vomeisenhaus on 08 March 2012 - 00:03
gsdpack... said "people in czech don't do legendary they do breedings to a a dog that will produce well with the bitch they have". Would that be a breeding such as jinopo did with ox that ibrahim was clearly dissapointed with and gave/sold said dog to his frined? Both stiud & bitch owned by jinopo. Many top kennels in europe are breeding to dogs that did not win the wusv or bsp. The pup in my avatar will be 10mo old tomorrow and will retrive dumbell over the hurdle and wall. And at a young age is starting to show "real working drives" capable of dual purpose police work and she is a female. :) . Father is 6x bsp participant opal von der roderburg. Best placing in bsp was 6th place.
by guddu on 08 March 2012 - 01:03
I dont want to speak for Ibrahim, but with my limited knowledge Erri is a total outcross.http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/german_shepherd_dog/dog.html?id=637853
This is a riskier process than having a line bred pup. Or am I mistaken ?. Perhaps Ibrahim or more experienced can comment.
by GSDPACK on 08 March 2012 - 01:03
What I said has nothing to do with Ibrahim's dog, Erri did not work out, well it happens. He will be a great dog for somebody else. Just because one person could not utilize a dog, does not mean that another would not be happy with the dog as he was.
Simple as that. One person wants oranges another apples...
I don't know the female to his former male so I will not make any comments on a dog I don't know.
I am only responding to your question to point out the reputable breeders with cheaper puppies, they are out there. The thing is those breeders have access to stud dogs that are starting to kind show what they are made out of, they are not "legendary" yet or if they don't get heavily advertised, they will never be "legendary".
Before the Legendary dog emerges, the puppies out of the same stud in a prior year were not a new obsession of the masses who had the stud dog thrown at them in every possible direction so he could be noticed. That means that they were not as wanted, therefore cheaper! Then suddenly a dog becomes "legendary" and the prices go up. Simple as that....
Pack
OP sorry and good luck with finding the info you are looking for...
Simple as that. One person wants oranges another apples...
I don't know the female to his former male so I will not make any comments on a dog I don't know.
I am only responding to your question to point out the reputable breeders with cheaper puppies, they are out there. The thing is those breeders have access to stud dogs that are starting to kind show what they are made out of, they are not "legendary" yet or if they don't get heavily advertised, they will never be "legendary".
Before the Legendary dog emerges, the puppies out of the same stud in a prior year were not a new obsession of the masses who had the stud dog thrown at them in every possible direction so he could be noticed. That means that they were not as wanted, therefore cheaper! Then suddenly a dog becomes "legendary" and the prices go up. Simple as that....
Pack
OP sorry and good luck with finding the info you are looking for...
by Mike Johnson on 08 March 2012 - 02:03
We can only hope that Ibrahim's dog with such a mellow personality will replace the shy, cowering dogs that to many people breed because they are "papered". Now, its definately a different purpose, but those genes are much better than the typical pet grade dogs used and if the temperment is there for a pet.....the breed would be better off.
by guddu on 18 March 2012 - 19:03
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by judron55 on 19 March 2012 - 12:03
People in Czech don't do Legendary, they do breedings to a dog that will produce well with the bitch they have.
http://www.working-dog.eu/zucht_ansehen.php?Rasse=2&land=183&searchterm=
This is a list of Czech breedings in the last 3 months...now, I know this isn't all, but, that statement above seems pretty ambiguious considering the facts:-) I'd say they are bringing in West German lines by the boatload. And going to winners (hopefully producers)By the way Sorbon Majoruv haj who seems to be getting a lot of breedings is a Ängsbacken's Rosso son:-) Vikar is breeding a number of his bitches to Rosso:-)
http://www.working-dog.eu/zucht_ansehen.php?Rasse=2&land=183&searchterm=
This is a list of Czech breedings in the last 3 months...now, I know this isn't all, but, that statement above seems pretty ambiguious considering the facts:-) I'd say they are bringing in West German lines by the boatload. And going to winners (hopefully producers)By the way Sorbon Majoruv haj who seems to be getting a lot of breedings is a Ängsbacken's Rosso son:-) Vikar is breeding a number of his bitches to Rosso:-)
by Ace952 on 19 March 2012 - 16:03
Judron,
From what I am coming across, I certainly agree with you. Here in the states, it seems like we use the terms "legendary", "the great" & 50 other adjectives to descibe dogs coming from the czech republic. To the new person you would have thought these dogs walked with Jesus, personally kept a country in control while playing poker.
Talk with breeders in the czech you do hear a different story. You hear that some while some well known dogs were very good, they weren't at "God-like" as they are perceived over here. With some dogs you hear the exact opposite. Some dogs which people brag about is in their dogs pedigree or linebred on, you find out are avoided in their home country.
I have noticed MANY using WGWL is their breedings. I agree that those breeders try to find the best dog possible to use in their breeding. Now again there are some that will breed just because of the name as they will sell pups but as with everything in life, it doesn't mean that everyone does it. I am guessing that they are trying to widen the genepool with dogs that have godo pedigrees and work well to help stregthen their breeding program.
From what I am coming across, I certainly agree with you. Here in the states, it seems like we use the terms "legendary", "the great" & 50 other adjectives to descibe dogs coming from the czech republic. To the new person you would have thought these dogs walked with Jesus, personally kept a country in control while playing poker.
Talk with breeders in the czech you do hear a different story. You hear that some while some well known dogs were very good, they weren't at "God-like" as they are perceived over here. With some dogs you hear the exact opposite. Some dogs which people brag about is in their dogs pedigree or linebred on, you find out are avoided in their home country.
I have noticed MANY using WGWL is their breedings. I agree that those breeders try to find the best dog possible to use in their breeding. Now again there are some that will breed just because of the name as they will sell pups but as with everything in life, it doesn't mean that everyone does it. I am guessing that they are trying to widen the genepool with dogs that have godo pedigrees and work well to help stregthen their breeding program.
by GSDPACK on 19 March 2012 - 19:03
Name that shows results sells. Yes kennels are bringing in the lines that not only sell but also show results. I like what they are doing, bringing larger genetic pool to the game. But still lets face it, some breeders still breed a dog, not a name. At least the ones I know. They like the dog, match the pedigree and hope for the best. Some work nicely some don't.
I think we will see some bad outcomes from these breeding combos and some really good ones (just like with everythin else). But it takes couple of generations to really see what the line, outcross or line breeding really is showing by consistency in the dogs.
Hope I make sence. If not then oh well...
There are some really good dogs out there that get overlooked. I still hope people will not limit themselves to only names. But I understand wy they do, again name sells te puppies.
There is use and need for many type of dogs, not just superior sport animals, but also for the lower drive/energy solid dogs that can be utilized for other purposes.
I think we will see some bad outcomes from these breeding combos and some really good ones (just like with everythin else). But it takes couple of generations to really see what the line, outcross or line breeding really is showing by consistency in the dogs.
Hope I make sence. If not then oh well...
There are some really good dogs out there that get overlooked. I still hope people will not limit themselves to only names. But I understand wy they do, again name sells te puppies.
There is use and need for many type of dogs, not just superior sport animals, but also for the lower drive/energy solid dogs that can be utilized for other purposes.
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