Transitioning back to kibble - Page 3

OK FM58

You mentioned that you are getting blends but you don't say that they have ground bones in them.

What bones do you feed and how much.

Can't imagine what 6 weeks of Tums or Orijen will do.


Dead bone do I picture your Vet wanting her to go catch her food so they will be almost live bone. LOL

Human Rad docs can do bone density tests....not sure they can do this for dogs.

I missed the tums part.....DUMB......doesn't work for humans either.

Western Rider the beef blend is 15% organ meat 10 % fat and 75 to 80% beef trim no bone. Beef tripe blend is 65% tripe10 % organ 20% beef trim 5 % trachea and gullet with fat content around 10%. I feed a large chicken back and a medium to small turkey neck with every meal total weight of bone apox. 9 to 10 ounces, I do 2 feedings am & pm.

I asked the Vet why tums and he said it is readily available and has calcium........they don't work for me either.

FM58

For every person out there feeding raw there will be a different idea and reason.  All are correct and all can be wrong.  It is a matter of what works.


If this was my dog here is what I would feed for the next 8 weeks and you can divide it up how it works for you.

I would feed her 1/2 pound of the tripe mix per day and  2 pounds or a little more of necks. I like chicken necks best if you can get them. You don't need the Beef mix when you feed this, she will be fine.

I think you have way to much Organ meat for the small amount of bone being fed and that is causing the problem.

Good luck and I hope you find what works.  After 8 weeks adjustments can be made.

I concur with western rider.  Chicken necks for sure.

I have been doing a bit of searching on this on the net, and have come across a few mentions of 'dead bone' and the potential for leaching of calcium from the skeletal structure. I just wonder if this is the latest 'scaremongering' of the anti raw lobby?  I have never come across this in all my years of raw feeding until now, it seems quite a recent idea, with no actual cases cited.  I cannot get my head around the idea that fresh bones are useless sources of calcium because they are 'dead' any more than I would think all the meat that we eat (that these bones come from) is useless because it is dead.

There is no doubt that the condition exists, but it seems to be more likely that absorbtion of the calcium may be a problem rather than the amount of calcium itself.  None of the sources I came across which mentioned 'dead bone' appear to be either scientific or medical.
If increasing the amount of calcium is required I hardly think kibble is the answer, and I would go with Western Rider. But I would wonder whether there is another problem underlying with absorbtion of the calcium like a vit D deficiency? As I said before I would dig deeper as well as increasing the calcium intake for now. I understand that if you need to 'add' calcium as a supplement, one of the best forms is ground eggshell.

Ground eggshell like Abby said.  Here's a site that tells you how:  http://www.petremedycharts.com/Learning%20Center/Nutrition/Nutrition/How_to_Make_a_Calcium_Supplement_for_Pets.html

Transitioning back to kibble by Jenni78 on 12 August 2012 - 16:08

Jenni78 Posts: 1830 Joined: Sun Sep 24, 2006 03:24 pm  Owner edit

I would be EXTREMELY careful with calcium supplements; is this vet highly specialized in nutrition and German Shepherds or orthopedic/skeletal concerns in large breeds?  What are you feeding? I mean, exactly. What made you take her to the vet? Any other health issues? If you're feeding a fairly balanced raw diet, I have major suspicions that whatever is going on with this dog is not just because of diet. The body has a great ability to rid itself of what it doesn't need in its natural form- less so with synthetic minerals.  I would look into a vitamin D deficiency, some type of malabsorption issue, hereditary thyroid issues, etc. I would hate to miss something underlying by just treating the symptoms.

Totally agree, Abby!!! Let's hope this vet gets to the bottom of it or the OP finds a new vet. 

There are several things to consider (few already mentioned above) if the 3.5 year old GSD is loosing calcium from her bones but her blood calcium levels are OK:
 
1. Overfeeding on liver - can cause a vitamin A toxicity (hypervitaminosis A) and causing skeletal lesions i.e. osteoporosis
 
2. Lack of correct calcium - phosphorus ratio (1.2 to 1.4 parts of calcium to 1 part phosphorus) thus luck of correct calcium absorption by the dogs organism
 
3. Vit. D deficiency - rickets or osteomalacia
 
4. Hyperparathyroidism - endocrine disorder (these glands can alter the metabolism of bone causing osteoporosis).
 
 
I would try SureGrow 100 supplement before switching to kibble. Kibble won't fix the problem - but will sure create a few new issues instead ... Not to advertise it, but I used this supplement as a preventative measure and never had any issues with my dogs  http://trophyanimalcare.com/page.php?ID_PRODUCTS=31449
 
With a currently going on war against RAW, they are coming up with more and more ridicules reasons why not to feed your dogs raw/ home cooked diets - "dead bone" common, anybody believes it? It's like believing that the cellulose they use as a filler is not an old newspaper but some very important dog food supplement...

Good luck and please keep us posted.