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by Jacko on 16 February 2011 - 04:02
How come HGH is never mentioned in "Working". Having your dog compete in the breed standard for points is a great sport. Having a dog that is very good looking and shows well, showing them is a good thing too. Working your dog every day with you tending your flock is called ???
Every dog has the area they are best in. Ruger 1, although I did not see her post, always has the proper outlook and words, POSITIVE words about the dogs.
The dogs are fine, it is the "people" with the issues.
Every dog has the area they are best in. Ruger 1, although I did not see her post, always has the proper outlook and words, POSITIVE words about the dogs.
The dogs are fine, it is the "people" with the issues.
by Rik on 16 February 2011 - 05:02
In the beginning Max (and associates) created the GSD. A helper to man.
They developed ways to proof and test the creation. Trials to show suitability for work and conformation to show what they considered proper to do the work. These evaluations went hand in hand with always suitability for work being the top priority.
Then the anti-Max entered the picture. He tempted mortal man to disregard Max. "You should turn the proofing's into competitions. Just think of the apples you can get from the U.S. if your GSD scores high in sport and the apples from China if he places high in conformation."
In the end, mortal man could not resist and he chose the apple, not the goal of the original creation.
To those that preferred sport, antiMax said "breed for prey, nothing else matters. They got lots of apples in the U.S. and they will swap them for points."
To those that preferred conformation, antiMax said "breed for gait, type and color, I have a few guys that can put the titles on them. And them Chinamen have more apples than they know what to do with. Listen to me. I'm gonna show you how to get the apples. Max knew what he wanted his creation to be, but he didn't know squat about apples."
anyway, that's the gospel according to
Rik
They developed ways to proof and test the creation. Trials to show suitability for work and conformation to show what they considered proper to do the work. These evaluations went hand in hand with always suitability for work being the top priority.
Then the anti-Max entered the picture. He tempted mortal man to disregard Max. "You should turn the proofing's into competitions. Just think of the apples you can get from the U.S. if your GSD scores high in sport and the apples from China if he places high in conformation."
In the end, mortal man could not resist and he chose the apple, not the goal of the original creation.
To those that preferred sport, antiMax said "breed for prey, nothing else matters. They got lots of apples in the U.S. and they will swap them for points."
To those that preferred conformation, antiMax said "breed for gait, type and color, I have a few guys that can put the titles on them. And them Chinamen have more apples than they know what to do with. Listen to me. I'm gonna show you how to get the apples. Max knew what he wanted his creation to be, but he didn't know squat about apples."
anyway, that's the gospel according to
Rik
by VonIsengard on 16 February 2011 - 05:02
Rik- LOVE IT!!!!
by Niesia on 16 February 2011 - 05:02
Rik,
Totally agree with your comment – whatever Max wanted doesn’t matter anymore… it’s not his breed anymore… From what I’ve read – Max had a lot of issues with anti-Maxes creating their “own“ types while he was still running SV. In 1925 Sieger Show he chose Ch. Klodo v. Boxberg as a model for a German Shepherd and what happened to the ‘look’ he chose…
I agree that anti-Max made a big business out of showing, training, breeding and selling GSD’s.
Totally agree with your comment – whatever Max wanted doesn’t matter anymore… it’s not his breed anymore… From what I’ve read – Max had a lot of issues with anti-Maxes creating their “own“ types while he was still running SV. In 1925 Sieger Show he chose Ch. Klodo v. Boxberg as a model for a German Shepherd and what happened to the ‘look’ he chose…
I agree that anti-Max made a big business out of showing, training, breeding and selling GSD’s.
by Niesia on 16 February 2011 - 06:02
I come from Poland where after WWII there were many GSDs left by German Army. My grandmother adopted one and he looked a lot like Klodo (hence I favor this look). For me “working dog” doesn’t come from a “working line” – Working dog is a dog that performs duties. Police dog would be a “working dog”, search and rescue dog would be a “working dog”, eye seeing dos would be a “working dog”, guard/herding dog on a farm would be a “working dog” – doesn’t matter what line they are coming from.
I believe that Schutzhund is just sport. Would you call a Mix breed dog with Sch3 title a “working dog”? What if that mix breed dog was out of Sch3 parents – would it make him a “working line mix breed” ?
I believe that Schutzhund is just sport. Would you call a Mix breed dog with Sch3 title a “working dog”? What if that mix breed dog was out of Sch3 parents – would it make him a “working line mix breed” ?
by Rik on 16 February 2011 - 06:02
@ Nesia: For me “working dog” doesn’t come from a “working line” – Working dog is a dog that performs duties. Police dog would be a “working dog”, search and rescue dog would be a “working dog”, eye seeing dos would be a “working dog”, guard/herding dog on a farm would be a “working dog” – doesn’t matter what line they are coming from.
Nesia, could not agree with you more. The proof is on the end of the leash, not the pedigree. The dog can do it or not.
Rik
Nesia, could not agree with you more. The proof is on the end of the leash, not the pedigree. The dog can do it or not.
Rik
by Gustav on 16 February 2011 - 13:02
I second that emotion!!!LOL....Good posts both of you!!
by tenmon on 16 February 2011 - 17:02
That was exactly what I said in my earlier post. Niesia and Rik are right on with their comments. These sport guys or even the conformation guys have moved to the extremes and have forgotten the "creators" words as to what he wanted the breed to do and look like. So when you have the showline and working line guys squaring off with their measuring sticks, they themselves do not understand the original intent of the GSD was created for. They are BOTH wrong!
by nickn on 16 February 2011 - 18:02
I don't know if you guys are familiar with the existence of "new" Scheaferhundvereins in Germany.
I am guessing that most people on this board would agree with their philosophy.
If your philosophy is same as theirs then why not promote something like this in USA/Canada
www.rsv2000.de/en/1/Home.html
Just out of curiosity, Is any of the board members also member of this institution?
I am guessing that most people on this board would agree with their philosophy.
If your philosophy is same as theirs then why not promote something like this in USA/Canada
www.rsv2000.de/en/1/Home.html
Just out of curiosity, Is any of the board members also member of this institution?
by gucci on 17 February 2011 - 02:02
Exactly Rik, I agree also.. Lida
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