Over-Socialization? - Page 3

joanro;
I'm not defensive at all, even when you resort to personal
jabs etc.
If I was remiss in articulating myself on this subject,
I certainly apologize now.I will see if I can have an
adult proof read my posts from now on
I was not aware I would have define
each and every word I used, but now I know I must.
Thank you.

To each their own, you feel getting a pup out into the world
is just a way to cover weak temperment, I feel it is a good way
to turn out a well rounded dog.

We happen to live in the city, but I did grow up as a farm boy,
so if you misunderstood my comments regarding not having
chicken and other livestock, I certainly apologize.
We are simply not permitted to keep livestock in the
city limits, so we use the urban setting as our 'farm'.

I would never demean farmers, without
them, we die. 

I do find it ironic that while you picked apart my ideology on
'showing a pup the world', you yourself on your website state
that you 'expose all dogs to livestock'. So, would that be
considered socializing? conditioning or?
Do you get what I am saying? See how easy it is to pick
apart someones words when you want?

I will make no apologies for believing all puppies should
be 'shown the world', some do need some 'help' in living
peacefully in this world, so for them, socializing can only
benefit them.

For a well bred solid nerved puppy, it does nothing
more than give him something new to see, and
provide a new environment and distractions to
practice obedience etc in. People in wheelchairs,
walkers, crutches, dragging oxygentanks, etc etc

Climbing on stacks of lumber at Home Depot, bags of dog
food at Petsmart, riding in a shopping cart, heeling next to
one, using an elevator or escalator etc etc. It's important
to us to see how our pups react to new stimuli. There is
no perfect dog, all will balk at 'something' eventually.
It's not even what they eventually 'stop' at, it's how/if
the pup recovers on it's own or not thats important to us.

My first GSD puppy was born social, he loved everyone. My second, a different story although he was socialized to death from the first day we got him. Camping trips, local malls and markets, puppy play groups, OB, you name it we did it with him. He was never a trustworthy dog in spite of all of that. I have to think that is mostly in the genes and that no amount of socializing is ever going to turn a poor temperament into a good one.

I agree 100% with Dogz's observation.................
 

For a well bred solid nerved puppy, it does nothing
more than give him something new to see, and
provide a new environment and distractions to
practice obedience etc in. People in wheelchairs,
walkers, crutches, dragging oxygentanks, etc etc
 

 

Wd, you're articulating quite well. However, I have not said socialization is not important and necessary, otherwise a dog will grow up to be a wild wacko with no clue as to how to blend with human society. I was speaking to the OP's question: need for over-socialization. I also never said that I feel getting a pup out into the world is only to cover week temperament. There's thunderstorm coming, so gotta go. We are on the same page in my opinion.

Kieth, I think you make a very good point. The best of dogs spending the first year or two of their life looking through a fence, can exhibit unwanted behavior in new circumstances.

Rik, I don't remember anyone thus far saying their dog spends the first year or two of their life looking through a fence, but that is very true what you said. That's why my dogs don't spend their life looking at the world through a fence. Wds, enrichment in a dog's life can be provided in as many ways as their are people who own them;)

joan, I said that, nothing wrong with your recolleccction at all. I said it as a comment on this thread and expanding on what Kieth's comment. do you have a point you are trying to make. maybe I am missing it.

No, just that I didn't see it and it is a sad truth that many dogs of any breed live out their lives in that manner.

I think this thread was destined to go awry by its title.  I'm not sure what over-socialization even means unless we're talking about things like dog parks which I consider fundamentally ridiculous.  On the other hand, I would submit that suggesting that proper socialization of any dog may or may not be necessary by virtue of his/her "strong nerves" is equally ridiculous.  All puppies need socialization to help them become familiar and self confident with the various people, sounds and unexpected happenings with which they will come in contact in the course of normal life.  That basic truth is undeniable for any of us who've actually worked with those dogs who never got that socialization.

I started this thread b/c I hear on other forums "socialization" being stressed 24/7.  It made me wonder why do folks go to such extremes and why is it stressed to the upmost. 

I see where first time GSD owners come online and they get beaten over the head to death with "congrats with your puppy.  Make sure to socialize!!  socialize!! socialize!!"  You start reading where people go out of their way to socalize their dogs out fo fear the dog will become a fear biter or not like people in general.

Stuff like that is what made me create this thread and wonder if people are doing too much socialization or better yet maybe not being explained what correct socialization is.  I don't go out of my way to socialize mine.  I work 8 hours a day during the week,  So when I come home they get walks and on the weekend if I go out, they are with me on short errands and all.  Living in Phoenix, when it is normally 110 degrees outside...their ain't much socializationg oing on...lol.  Socialization normally comes at my club field.

With the 2 dogs I have they have always run up to strangers on leash and loved to be petted and all.  That doesn't bother me as I saw from 9 weeks old it was their personality.  As they got older it changed and they became more aloof.

Do German Shepherds need socialization, most yes.  Some, no.
I agree with joanro.  I've had and seen many dogs that have never gone off of the farm that were extremely outgoing.  It is definitely genetic.  However, because the GSD is  bred to be wary of strangers, the chance of some (most?) being bred to need socializing is more prevalent.
I have socialized some of my GSD's more then others, but as someone else mentioned above, the result seemed to be mostly the same.  Some things were overcome, but the basic temperament (genetic) is not changed.  If they are sharp, they are always sharp. 
Yes, you can accustom them to sights and sounds, different types of ground, but a skittish dog is always going to be skittish when encountering something new.