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by beetree on 27 September 2013 - 04:09
Just be consistent and don't tolerate the behavior. Good Luck.
by Hundmutter on 27 September 2013 - 05:09
A 4-mth puppy may well 'grow out' of doing this.
Would not stress too much ! Carry on keeping her
occupied in other ways, with the flirt pole, finding things
by doing small Tracking sessions, etc, so that
she isn't doing it from boredom; PRAISE her whenever
she STOPS, whether naturally or on a learned correction
from you. And, yes, watch your timing, and be consistent.
Would not stress too much ! Carry on keeping her
occupied in other ways, with the flirt pole, finding things
by doing small Tracking sessions, etc, so that
she isn't doing it from boredom; PRAISE her whenever
she STOPS, whether naturally or on a learned correction
from you. And, yes, watch your timing, and be consistent.
by LynOD on 27 September 2013 - 13:09
I had a dog who did this. She was an extremely high drive dog who needed alot of exercise and mental stimulation. She would do it when she got excited or when she was bored. I always interupted it and redirected it. It did deminish with age but never went completely away. She was a very busy girl who had a hard time settling and didn't really like to be petted. Looking back I know I would deal with things a little differently. I would have held her more and stroked her more til her system adjusted to it. I would still do the interuption and redirection with the tail chasing. My Border collie didn't like being held and petted as a young pup and because of my GSD girl I had times everyday where she had to sit in my lap and settle and be stroked. She learned to love it and now is quite the snuggle bug. My GSD was never a snuggle bug. Good luck. My girl was from Czech Border patrol lines not sure if that had anything to do with it genetically.
Lyn
Lyn
by Blaineric on 27 September 2013 - 13:09
My girl chased her tail when she was younger. She didn't do it every day, but enough that it caused some concern for me. Every time I caught her doing it, I'd just clap my hands really loud to get her attention and she'd stop. Haven't seen her chase her tail in months.
by Prager on 01 October 2013 - 15:10
Blaineris is a good solution.
You do NOT want to redirect her attention or to cuddle her AFTER the dog displays such behavior. . If you do so then you are rewarding the behavior with positive outcome. This behavior-spinning - needs to be looked at as on an addiction. You can teach the dog to chase its tail, thus it is a learned behavior. I mean dog who does this is usually pretty smart and gets bored easily. For one reason or another the dog learns that if it spins or start chase the tail then he will feel better. Adrenaline is induced during such action and dog
dog becomes adrenaline addicted. Dog learns that when s/he gets adrenaline fix that s/he will feel better. Thus I would not wait in hope that it will go away since longer the addiction last the longer and more difficult it is to get rid of it.
Solution.
When people get addicted to something, sometimes they have willpower to stop. Dog does not have such will. Thus we need to ask why the dog does this? Dogs have certain drives which needs to be satisfied. If they are not satisfied dogs ( or other animals) will choose substitute behaviors. Usually it is mindless repetitive motion or spinning. This then may lead to other problems, like self mutilation or aggression and so on.
If you see the dog to display such behavior at first(!!!) time and then every time you see it, you need to make the dog stop by correcting it negatively and remove the dog from the environment which caused hem/her to get that way. More on this later. Yes, some may argue that by correcting the dog, you are adding stress and stress caused this behavior in the first place. But this negative correction is not a consequence of stressful environment, but it is a consequence of certain behavior which the dog have chosen or was compelled to do. Thus there is a big difference between these stresses. The dog needs to learn and subsequently to be conditioned that the outcome of such choice of spinning is negative ( and not positive as it is in case of adrenaline addiction) and since dogs want to avoid negative they will try to avoid such behavior. However the negative correction must be natural and thus inheritably understandable to the dog on its primal inherited level. Normally I suggest that you "growl" NO with growling voice and grab the dog or pup by the scarf of the neck (simulates bite) and hold it very firmly and decisively, but not necessarily painfully, same as the mama dog or dominant male dog would do. Dogs have inherited response to submit to such action by laying on the ground. As soon as dog lays on the ground you must release the grip or the dog may get into panic mode. When the dog responds by laying down you need to go to calm neutral mode at first and then
proceed with walk or other exercise as if nothing would happen. The succession of the actions described above is very important-imperative.
Reconditioning and prevention.
When you reach this point then you need to recognize what stimulus or stress or environment caused the dog to spin in the first place. If it is confinement then you must stop such confinement or shorten the length of it. If it is for example excitement caused by seeing another dog then recondition the dog BEFORE the dog start to spin by substitute behavior. Please keep in mind that this will however address only this particular type of situation. Thus you see another dog and before your dog starts to spin ( as your experience tells you he has propensity to do so) you talk to the dog with happy voice and play fetch or give it a treat so the dog instead of spinning (or being aggressive ) learns to look for game of fetch or tug of war. That then leads the dog to getting conditioned or reconditioned to acceptable behavior. It is important to start this conditioning ASAP. Because during reconditioning you are trying to overpower initial spinning addiction by reconditioning the dog your action must be immediate, persistent, consistent and will involve large number of repetitions. This reconditioning will take by my experience multiple times the amount of repetitions which caused the dog to spin. Thus this will not happen when you do this 1x-5x but this will take 100- 300 repetitions., to fix.
Most important is to understand that if the dog spins in certain environment, like specific confinement, when you are not around, then you MUST remove him/her from such environment immediately.
As far as teaching what NO command/correction is, it is important not to just use it when dog spins or does something else wrong as described above, but also use it in proper positive / negative obedience training. You will do your self and to the dog great favor if you will teach him/her what NO means during obedience and training and in every day interaction with the dog.
One rule. Always say NO before you correct the dog physically. That will condition the dog to stop what ever they are doing at that time just when they hear "NO! ",.... let it be attacking a speeding car or as it is in this case spinning.
Prager Hans
You do NOT want to redirect her attention or to cuddle her AFTER the dog displays such behavior. . If you do so then you are rewarding the behavior with positive outcome. This behavior-spinning - needs to be looked at as on an addiction. You can teach the dog to chase its tail, thus it is a learned behavior. I mean dog who does this is usually pretty smart and gets bored easily. For one reason or another the dog learns that if it spins or start chase the tail then he will feel better. Adrenaline is induced during such action and dog
dog becomes adrenaline addicted. Dog learns that when s/he gets adrenaline fix that s/he will feel better. Thus I would not wait in hope that it will go away since longer the addiction last the longer and more difficult it is to get rid of it.
Solution.
When people get addicted to something, sometimes they have willpower to stop. Dog does not have such will. Thus we need to ask why the dog does this? Dogs have certain drives which needs to be satisfied. If they are not satisfied dogs ( or other animals) will choose substitute behaviors. Usually it is mindless repetitive motion or spinning. This then may lead to other problems, like self mutilation or aggression and so on.
If you see the dog to display such behavior at first(!!!) time and then every time you see it, you need to make the dog stop by correcting it negatively and remove the dog from the environment which caused hem/her to get that way. More on this later. Yes, some may argue that by correcting the dog, you are adding stress and stress caused this behavior in the first place. But this negative correction is not a consequence of stressful environment, but it is a consequence of certain behavior which the dog have chosen or was compelled to do. Thus there is a big difference between these stresses. The dog needs to learn and subsequently to be conditioned that the outcome of such choice of spinning is negative ( and not positive as it is in case of adrenaline addiction) and since dogs want to avoid negative they will try to avoid such behavior. However the negative correction must be natural and thus inheritably understandable to the dog on its primal inherited level. Normally I suggest that you "growl" NO with growling voice and grab the dog or pup by the scarf of the neck (simulates bite) and hold it very firmly and decisively, but not necessarily painfully, same as the mama dog or dominant male dog would do. Dogs have inherited response to submit to such action by laying on the ground. As soon as dog lays on the ground you must release the grip or the dog may get into panic mode. When the dog responds by laying down you need to go to calm neutral mode at first and then
proceed with walk or other exercise as if nothing would happen. The succession of the actions described above is very important-imperative.
Reconditioning and prevention.
When you reach this point then you need to recognize what stimulus or stress or environment caused the dog to spin in the first place. If it is confinement then you must stop such confinement or shorten the length of it. If it is for example excitement caused by seeing another dog then recondition the dog BEFORE the dog start to spin by substitute behavior. Please keep in mind that this will however address only this particular type of situation. Thus you see another dog and before your dog starts to spin ( as your experience tells you he has propensity to do so) you talk to the dog with happy voice and play fetch or give it a treat so the dog instead of spinning (or being aggressive ) learns to look for game of fetch or tug of war. That then leads the dog to getting conditioned or reconditioned to acceptable behavior. It is important to start this conditioning ASAP. Because during reconditioning you are trying to overpower initial spinning addiction by reconditioning the dog your action must be immediate, persistent, consistent and will involve large number of repetitions. This reconditioning will take by my experience multiple times the amount of repetitions which caused the dog to spin. Thus this will not happen when you do this 1x-5x but this will take 100- 300 repetitions., to fix.
Most important is to understand that if the dog spins in certain environment, like specific confinement, when you are not around, then you MUST remove him/her from such environment immediately.
As far as teaching what NO command/correction is, it is important not to just use it when dog spins or does something else wrong as described above, but also use it in proper positive / negative obedience training. You will do your self and to the dog great favor if you will teach him/her what NO means during obedience and training and in every day interaction with the dog.
One rule. Always say NO before you correct the dog physically. That will condition the dog to stop what ever they are doing at that time just when they hear "NO! ",.... let it be attacking a speeding car or as it is in this case spinning.
Prager Hans
by yellowrose of Texas on 01 October 2013 - 17:10
Chsing the tail is a Learned Behaviour..yes Prager is correct and he addressed.
You have to remember every little thing you do may ReWARD so you must watch your commands or how you manage to correct this habit,.it is a habit....just like some adults tap their foot all the time...drives me crazy..
YR
You have to remember every little thing you do may ReWARD so you must watch your commands or how you manage to correct this habit,.it is a habit....just like some adults tap their foot all the time...drives me crazy..
YR
by Blaineric on 01 October 2013 - 17:10
I'm guilty of the foot tapping, haha. Parents slapping my leg really hard when they see me do it did nothing. Perhaps I should tell them to clap next time.
by yellowrose of Texas on 01 October 2013 - 17:10
A lot of us have habits that could have been stopped when we were young and same
routine with pups You have to watch your high drive dogs or pups keep them in drive with food, balls , tugs and tax their motives to do good things and reward only the good,,,teaching then one thing at a time short time and go on to tax their intelligence. If pup shows stress U need to seek valuable instruction from breeder or professional ,. I do not know how to handle a stress situation.
Dog imprinting is very important as every professional trainer of any salt will tell you , retraining any animal to correct any bad habit or badly learned behaviour or even a badly learned command by a trainer who did not know the right way, is very difficult to CORRECT.
Takes a lot of time that could be spent training something of value so just do not let puppies learn or continue to chase tails etc
Here is a BOMBER PUP posted earlier by his new owner NA7 on GSD forum,.post below..Guess he won't be chasing any tails just the tug or bite toy...,Keep your pup energized and tired out so he sleeps and relaxes when alone or not being entertained,
,
the old saying for us humans is Hard to teach an OLD DOG new tricks,,,..
YR
routine with pups You have to watch your high drive dogs or pups keep them in drive with food, balls , tugs and tax their motives to do good things and reward only the good,,,teaching then one thing at a time short time and go on to tax their intelligence. If pup shows stress U need to seek valuable instruction from breeder or professional ,. I do not know how to handle a stress situation.
Dog imprinting is very important as every professional trainer of any salt will tell you , retraining any animal to correct any bad habit or badly learned behaviour or even a badly learned command by a trainer who did not know the right way, is very difficult to CORRECT.
Takes a lot of time that could be spent training something of value so just do not let puppies learn or continue to chase tails etc
Here is a BOMBER PUP posted earlier by his new owner NA7 on GSD forum,.post below..Guess he won't be chasing any tails just the tug or bite toy...,Keep your pup energized and tired out so he sleeps and relaxes when alone or not being entertained,
,the old saying for us humans is Hard to teach an OLD DOG new tricks,,,..
YR
by Prager on 01 October 2013 - 17:10
One imprinting which needs to be done is to teach the pup to be calm and alone.
by beetree on 01 October 2013 - 17:10
Look, I know what you are saying but, when it is OCD driven that has to be nerves. It is not "boredom" driving the urge then. A corporal punishment is not the ticket, IMHO. The action is stimulating and that reward needs to be interrupted. However you want to say it. Always deny triggers for the action. Never reward or love on any undesirable behavior. Be consistent and be in control. Good luck.
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