The Complete German Shepherd - Page 2

Good omen there from Sheesh. . . I've always wanted a "fusion" of both show & workinglines, to simply erase "the-one-dog, two-variant syndrom" as we now have. But the problem's that we have "great pretenders" here in this forum, who pretend they don't even have a toilet in their homes, let alone make a dime out of this beautiful breed. Check-out movement in some show dogs, absolutely weak. Why don't we simply get a "balanced gsd" that'll appeal n appease both extreme. I'd always love the "showdog" compared to the "workingline" that i know's much stronger. Afterall, how many of us live in an open grassland. The both strains should be "MERGED" period.

Umm, my dog comes from a kkl1 father and a kkl1 grandfather both V rated and yes they are pure black and oh they beat many of those MUCH prettier show line dogs. Then they absolutely obliterated those pretty dogs in protection. It goes both ways and you can't cry about how workingline people bash on showline dogs ability to work and in the same breath bash on the workingline dogs looks. First and foremost Max von Stephanitz himself put the most value on the dogs ability to work everything else was secondary. He did care about the structure obviously however only in so much as it helped the dog be able to work, he also made it clear that dogs bred for looks were not being bred for the right reason. Don't have to like it but it is true, the color of the dog is a non issue, infact the white gene comes from Max Von Stephanitz OWN dog.

Secondly the working lines have been bred specifically for work with nothing but work and work temperament for years and years now, the show dogs have been bred for structure and looks first and working ability second this is also not really up for debate because it is true. That said the dogs ability to work is on a dog by dog basis, and I personally love a good dog regardless of line so long as it can work. However I cannot expect my working line bitch to gait as well as a AL or GSL line dog, that is not where her breeders focus. Just like you cannot expect the majority of show dogs to hold a candle to the majority of working dogs ability to work.

If you are breeding a dog that has great structure and focusing on your dogs ability to work then you are doing exactly what is expected of us as keepers of the breed to do. I KNOW your dogs are probably kickass protection dogs with a serious attitude and mind on their shoulders. However the majority of showlines will not excel as much as the majority of working lines in protection type events just like the majority of working lines will not excel at movement. Obviously there will always be exceptions, an to the OP point I hope you find the exact mix you are looking for and I think it is great you are being open minded enough to try and mix the lines to what you think will be best. Best of luck to all involved.

I love the saddle back markings on a showline but the "heart" of a working dog. They have something special inside them. I think, IMO, the best dog I have ever seen is this one. She has the look I love & that something special inside. I hope the owner doesn't mind me posting her pic, if so I'll take it down. I believe that the showline & working line are 2 different dogs & should be treated so. Showline people that think they can compete at the top level with working lines (WUSV) are fooling themselves & working line people probably aren't going to take first at the big show. There are rare ocasions that a dog comes along & does GOOD in both but not excel in both. If you can succefully mix the 2 & get back to where it started than that would be awesome but to do that you have to change the minds of the breeders, judges, owners & whoever else & there opinions on what a GSD should be. Unfortunatly thats probably harder than creating the perfect GSD. Again just my opinion. 


http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/german_shepherd_dog/dog.html?id=563607

That is a nice looking dog :)

I've loved this dog since I saw her picture & saw her in person. She has a stacked working pedigree, drive through the roof, solid nerves, & the looks that I absolutly love. I don't know how to judge a dog as far as looks go (show dogs) but I think she is gorgeous. One of my favorite by far.

Very beautiful and solid bitch. I like her too. I know that there will ALWAYS be the division between SL and WL, there are purests on both sides, AND there is much more money to be made with the division for many breeders. IMHO, I am seeing so much dilution in drive and character of SL, (not ALL, but a growing number). I, for one, am getting tired of seeing the fluffy black and RED oooohhs and aaahs at the SS That cower and cringe at the gunfire, and clearly are hanging on barely by a tooth in the protection. It is not ALL of them, but an alarming number for sure. I think both sides, WL and SL can agree if they are honest, that both lines can bring something positive to the table. I want to try to achieve some consistency in producing the total GSD. And- someone e-mailed me saying "it's all in the lack of training done by SL owners." NO, that may be the case sometimes, but does not account for the "heart" that I am talking about. My bitch is "normal". She is nice to look at, she tracks like a CHAMP, OB is ok, protection drives are "ehh". Britta von der Koenig Haus. I love her to pieces, she is being trained and titled by ME. I know she has something to offer, but I KNOW I can improve. I am beig honest with myself. The male is Thor Eisen West. He has everything I love. Have worked him a bunch, he is as solid as they get. I love this dog too.

I would agree about the work ethic comment, I know for a fact that the show people put their heart and soul into it, obviously not all of them but that goes without saying and for both sides working and show. I also would agree because I am a 100% true believer in the fact that though puppies and dogs are a crapshoot that DNA and pedigree are the most essential part of the beginnings of a good German Shepherd. I am all for nurture however nature is being ignored more and more often and in my honest opinion nature is most important of all. You can take a good dog and make it great however great dogs are born and excellence stems from them. The creator of the breed understood this better than anyone which is where the sport of Schutzhund was born, those with the strongest genes produce the strongest offspring, and though it is true a good dog or even a mediocre dog can produce excellent dogs the percentage is not in their favor. Whether it is working or show we should be obsessed with finding those great dogs and building off of them. It is why I wish you the most of luck in trying to develope the dogs you are looking to create.

Thanks Fenrir. I think we are on the same page. :-)

Nice!

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