need tracking help please - Page 2

You can teach articles separate from the track.  IOW, don't start teaching articles on a half mile track, but say today we're working on articles.  I know people (not SchH) who use all kinds of things for articles, not just the ones you buy that are common in trials - eyeglass cases, a toothbrush, anything with their scent on it.  I've gotten to the tracking field and realized I forgot my "official" articles so used a glove, a hairbrush, another glove, and (showing faith in my dog since it was getting dark), my car keys.

Here's a link to an article about beginning article training.  Frankly, I've only skimmed it, but am sending it to you as just one way of multiple ways.  You'll decide yourself what to do:  http://www.schutzhundvillage.com/nose2.html

"I am probably an unlikely candidate for serious dog training. I was a high school cheerleader then got my B.S. in Education so teaching with tons of positive reinforcement comes easily for me, but I probably would be frowned on in competition. I constantly do little "cheers" and yell "HE'S THE WINNER" when my boy does what I ask him to do. It's way over the top for competition I'm sure, but he LOVES it, and that makes me happy. If it ever stopped being fun, there'd be no reason to continue."

I love it.  This explains why your dog is doing so well. 

With your positive attititude and degree in Education you're a wonderful candidate for serious dog training!  Since you're training a puppy, the enthusiasm is great.  As you both proceed, you can make the praise/treats (the reinforcements) less often and more intermittent.  If you studied about conditioning in school, you'll know that unpredicatable rewards result in better performances - the dog works harder for the reward since he doesnt know exactly when it will come.  You went from lots of food reward on the track to less, and that didn't turn him off, right?  So eventually the dog will be performing well for a pat or an ear scritchy or a quiet word of praise between exercises in the competition ring.  You can still go nuts in training.

Adreva,

Again you'll need to decide what sort of tracking you want to pursue as SAR is very different from AKC and Schutzhund.  I am experienced in SchH so that is what I will speak to.

In Schutzhund, the picture you want on the track is a dog with a deep nose, intense concentration, working the track.  The goal of the SchH dog is to find and indicate articles laid in the middle of the track.

As you see, these articles are no more than an inch wide by three inches long and must be carpet, wood or leather.

All dogs start SchH tracking with just a laid track and 'food' as a reward.  Food is not a 'find it' item.  Any dog will 'find' food just note counter cruisers!   The food on the track is a positive reward for a job well done.  IE it is a message to your dog 'follow the scent of the disturbed earth no matter what else tempts you (rabbit dung, deer crossing, etc) and you find food.'   It is actually an 'obedience' and just following a laid track with food is the basic step.

When you introduce the articles, you are upping the anty.  Now, no longer is it just 'follow the disturbed earth and find food' you are further asking the dog to independently identify the article with a behavior.  Again, in my training that behavior is 'platz'.  I will be 33 feet behind my dog but my dog knows that the minute he comes upon wood/carpet/leather he is to STOP tracking and platz without my saying a word.

Because this can kill drive to track, most people introduce articles well away from the tracking field.  There are many, many different ways to work articles, some using only positive reinforcement, some compulsion, some a mix.  You'll have to look around to see what you think would work best for you and your dog.

Once the dog will consistantly indicate the articles off the track, you introduce them to the track.

Again, this is SchH tracking, I believe that in SAR more 'air scenting' is used and rather than the dog showing obedience to the handler you need to be able to trust your dog is leading you correctly.  I have no experience with AKC and unfortunately I have not heard of many cases where a dog trained in one style multi-tasks smoothly into the others.

Actually, you've probably read all these articles, since you said you picked up tracking from online.  But here are more links:

http://www.schutzhund-training.com/tracking.html

Tracking vid:  http://www.ehow.com/video_2349027_understand-schutzhund-tracking.html

Interview here, but you can see how you've got to be prepared for all conditions.  Sounds right up your alley!  http://www.workingdogs.com/floydwilson.htm

Also, what about track age?  You talked about different surfaces, but do you lay your track and then go run it right away, or do you wait?  If you're not waiting, then start, say with 20 minutes, and gradually get longer.  Actually, the 20 minute track through grass and fields should be easier for your dog to follow that a non-aged track.

Sooo much great help thank you all so very much! I wish I'd joined this list when I first got my boy. OK, tonight I will be reading more about tracking and also playing hide and seek in the house with some leather items. Lately, when we play in the house, I usually hide his tug toy or his brush because he recognizes those words when I tell him to find them. When he finds them he always prances around so proud of himself while I clap. Now I guess I should make him "down" until I take the item from him then cheer?

There is a lot to learn, but with help from you, I feel like we'll get where we need to be. As for a tracking discipline, I'd prefer SAR since I am in a rural area and trained as a First Responder for our state Homeland Security. In an emergency, having a tracking dog may save a life. Do SAR dogs always have to be trained to air scent?

Tess, yes you are right about randomly rewarding a behavior being more effective. I should probably work on controlling my excitement a little more, but he's just so amazing I find restraining my joy with him very difficult. :)

About the age of the track:  When we started, I would let him follow the track almost immediately, but now the track is so long by the time I retrace my steps back to the house and put his harness on him, it's probably been at least 20 minutes. I also try to get him out early in the morning when there is still dew on the ground.

wow lots of good info on here especially from Tess. I hope that you keep going your dog sounds like fun. Don't worry aout competitions keep the fun alive!

where are you from I might know some clubs by you that could help?