characteristic of a dog suitable for LE - Page 1

Pedigree Database

 

by xPyrotechnic on 11 April 2020 - 18:04

I was analysing Ajax Girmido in the post that duke made, and he said that he would sell that dog as a PP dog, what about him does not make him suitable for LE. When looking at the video he was thrashing in his bite he had a good hold and bark and he put his leg on the helper so there was some fight not a massive amount like when some dogs fully wrap their legs around the helper, was there not enough natural aggression.

Koots

by Koots on 11 April 2020 - 19:04

I am not sure exactly what Duke meant, but it may have more to do with the dog's hunt drive, and not his ability to take on the man in a fight. Most of the LE K9 calls involve a search or track, the 'bread & butter' of the unit, and not necessarily a bite. If a dog does not have great hunt drive and wanting to find & follow the trail or search for evidence/drugs/etc. then it would not be great for many K9 units. Not all K9 units need a dog with great hunt drive, but many do. When I was training (as quarry or 'bad guy') with a new class of K9's, one of the dogs had great apprehension profiles but was washed from the program due to a lower-than-desired hunt drive. That department needed a dog that could track/search very well as most of their calls involved just that and very few involved an apprehension or bite.

by xPyrotechnic on 11 April 2020 - 19:04

ah so its possibly because hes not multi puropose as modern k9 units use dogs that can search, track and be a man stopper

by ValK on 11 April 2020 - 20:04

nowhere duke mentioned that dog isn't fit for LE.
i don't know that dog and video isn't full picture of dog's personality but from what in video it's seems like that dog less emotion driven/less impulsive and more calm/balanced type. in fact that dog makes pretty good impression and clearly such type would be better candidate for PP than more common today in WL the hyped up, impulsive type.

Koots

by Koots on 11 April 2020 - 21:04

ah so its possibly because hes not multi puropose as modern k9 units use dogs that can search, track and be a man stopper

I think you're confusing a dual-purpose K9 (narcotics, apprehension) with the single-purpose K9 (apprehension OR narcotic/explosive/etc.).   Many of the apprehension K9s still need to track a suspect or find a person in a building (search).    Therefore, hunt drive is VERY important to 'propel' the dog to complete the task - find the person - and not give up until they do.  Where I did quarry work, one of the most common call-outs for the K9 was a home/business robbery or a car theft bail.   Both involved tracking the suspect(s), many of which gave up when they were found, and a bite was not done/needed.    The psychological impact of being faced with a K9 is very powerful, and many people would rather give up than be bitten.


by duke1965 on 12 April 2020 - 05:04

good question pyro

its important to get the right dog for the right job, Ajax was bred out of old lines selected for patrolwork, and he was typical suitable for that by his balance of drives, 

therefore he was a great dog for patrol or protectionwork, by total lack of prey/posession he was not so much suitable for sending away after a fleeing suspect or a buildingsearch for example

second thing to recognize about dogs suitable for police ia that almost every department and every country has a different idea of what the perfect dog for them would be like, so if you want to set up breeding program, you must know what your clients will be looking for, generally speaking we see more and more vendors who recognize problems now with prey only/mostly dogs and look for dogs that will not be biting on sleeve or suit only

back to Ajax, I must say that we bred real good policedogs out of him, by breeding him to higher drive females, so its not allways about the qualities of the male or female you use, but the combination what is brought together is of greater importance

 


emoryg

by emoryg on 12 April 2020 - 17:04

I was going to follow up with what Koots and Duke said. There is so much more to a police dog than just the bite. That part is just a small percentage of activity in the police dog's career.

The dog must be highly motivated and enjoy the work. He must have natural desires and instincts that push him along. Its always good that he works to make you happy, but work must be what makes him happy.

by Hired Dog on 12 April 2020 - 17:04

Emory, your last sentence is where the truth lies in all working dogs. Yes, there is a small degree of the dog doing things for you, but, at the end of the day, the dog is working to satisfy its own drives and its what makes such a dog a pleasure to work with.
I worked a female lab as my bomb detection dog years a go and when my son was 2 years old, I would give him her leash and he would walk around the car telling her to "seek" and she did, not for him, I could have put a monkey at the end of the leash, she did it to satisfy her own drives, but, found what I was looking for anyway.

by GSCat on 13 April 2020 - 03:04

Maybe lack of ball drive... harder to train for odor detection (narcotics, bomb/accellerant, cadaver, etc.). Maybe won't work for a reward toy.

Or the dog may not have enough initiative, discrimination between good guy/bad guy, iffy on/off, too easily influenced by strangers, too "soft," etc., etc., etc.

by Lobovonder on 13 April 2020 - 12:04

Emoryg and Hired Dog.I fully agree with what both of you have mentioned. I think the basis of an excellent police dog as to an average police dog is just that,"the desire to do the job regardless of the conditions faced while doing so". How many times I have seen certified police dogs stop tracking or refuse to start a track because of harsh weather conditions or bad environmental conditions (dry,ground etc). I always thought that my dogs were good because they got something out of doing the job,not because they wanted to please me. Just like in people you have dogs that are true warriors and you have some that go along as long as there are no difficulties. The partnership that we develope with them as they learn the job does reach a point where they trust us enough that if we say do it they don't question and just do it because they realize we would not ask them if we thought they couldn't. The average dog wouldn't even try regardless because he doesn't have that extra inner resource to push him through.

Mike






 


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