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by Jenni78 on 10 September 2010 - 19:09
Wow, Hans. Interesting, and disturbing.
I almost said I'd take that dog, but thought better of it. I have too much on my plate already, though at least I would find him a proper home with an owner possessing some tiny shred of common sense.
I almost said I'd take that dog, but thought better of it. I have too much on my plate already, though at least I would find him a proper home with an owner possessing some tiny shred of common sense.
by windwalker18 on 11 September 2010 - 06:09
If the owners of both dogs ignored the 1st incident and allowed it to happen again, let us hope that they place the GSD, or choose NOT to get any small dogs/cats to live in the same house. I've one dog with a really strong prey drive about cats... I mean he's FOCUSED... but as long as I'm in the room he leaves them alone. I don't kid myself that if he were left with a cat when I was out of the room/house the cat would be safe though. If they're dumb enough to consider another small dog, grab big boy and save him... they don't deserve him.
by july9000 on 11 September 2010 - 13:09
I have 3 GSD, 3 Airedales 1 teckel and 7 cats...everybody get along just fine..
Some dogs just don't get along and there is nothing you can do about it..yeah..you can stop a fight if you are there but they will kill each other if left alone...
It happened before that some dogs we had just didn't fit in the group..what we do is find them great families that will accept us to travel with the dog for the shows and an occasionnal litter (if it is a female).
I don't want to have to deal with that issue anymore..you don't fit..you're out!!
Some dogs just don't get along and there is nothing you can do about it..yeah..you can stop a fight if you are there but they will kill each other if left alone...
It happened before that some dogs we had just didn't fit in the group..what we do is find them great families that will accept us to travel with the dog for the shows and an occasionnal litter (if it is a female).
I don't want to have to deal with that issue anymore..you don't fit..you're out!!
by Prager on 11 September 2010 - 14:09
I don't want to have to deal with that issue anymore..you don't fit..you're out!!
Yeah! Let someone else deal with your problem dog? How do you justify that?
Just curious.
Yes I also have dogs who do not get alone and I agree that there is often not much you can do if you are not around. That is why I manage my dogs in such a way that they are not able to fight when I am not around. One in one out and so on. No big deal.
Prager Hans
http://www.alpinek9.com
by Jenni78 on 12 September 2010 - 12:09
July, how is there "nothing you can do about it"?
I thought that was why God make crates, kennels, doors, chains, leashes, etc.
If I adopted your philosophy, gosh, I wouldn't have any dogs. And I would sure hate the pansy-ass dogs I had to choose from.
Get fish if you want a big happy family instead of dogs with some strength of character and temperament.
I thought that was why God make crates, kennels, doors, chains, leashes, etc.
If I adopted your philosophy, gosh, I wouldn't have any dogs. And I would sure hate the pansy-ass dogs I had to choose from.
Get fish if you want a big happy family instead of dogs with some strength of character and temperament.
by july9000 on 12 September 2010 - 13:09
Of course you can do something about it like keeping them apart...But that is not what I want here in my kennel...I personnally think sometimes they will have a better life in a family with no other dogs that's all..Those dogs are not necerally problems dogs!! And I DO NOT TRANSFER PROBLEM TO SOMEONE ELSE..I had some cases of dogs coming back that had owners who let them do what they wanted, became agressive and then I took them back to evaluate and see what the problem was before trying to find a place suited for them..One time I waited 2 years before I found a place for one of those case..I do not give problems to others. When I train the others are crated or in the kennel but most of the time they are together..
I had up to 12 dogs (working and showlines) all together with no fights..now I have less cause that's what I want.
Jenni That makes me laugh when you say get fish instead of dogs with some character. Because it's not because your dog has a lot of temperament that he is necessarelly agressive or has isssue with other dogs or cats..that's bull!!
It 's like saying agressive dogs always have great temprament and force of character...sometime it's the most sisi's that are agressive...
Listen..you want to pass your day breaking fights and hear barking..that's alright with me..I don't judge you for that or say you have unbalanced and agressive dogs or you don't assume leadership and that is why it's happening. Why they fight I don't know and it is not my business..it is yours.
Some of the agressive cases are great dogs when they are alone with no other pets..I have seen cases who where not agressive with some and could'nt stand others..Just like humans..there is some people we just can't stand..sometimes we don't know why but that's the way it is. Nothing is perfect!
I had up to 12 dogs (working and showlines) all together with no fights..now I have less cause that's what I want.
Jenni That makes me laugh when you say get fish instead of dogs with some character. Because it's not because your dog has a lot of temperament that he is necessarelly agressive or has isssue with other dogs or cats..that's bull!!
It 's like saying agressive dogs always have great temprament and force of character...sometime it's the most sisi's that are agressive...
Listen..you want to pass your day breaking fights and hear barking..that's alright with me..I don't judge you for that or say you have unbalanced and agressive dogs or you don't assume leadership and that is why it's happening. Why they fight I don't know and it is not my business..it is yours.
Some of the agressive cases are great dogs when they are alone with no other pets..I have seen cases who where not agressive with some and could'nt stand others..Just like humans..there is some people we just can't stand..sometimes we don't know why but that's the way it is. Nothing is perfect!
by Jenni78 on 12 September 2010 - 15:09
July, you're speaking of dog aggression in your post to me. Where did I ever say I had any DA dogs on my property? I don't own a single DA dog. What I do own a few of are dogs who will simply not give up, and dominant dogs.
Pass my day breaking up fights? Barking? If that's what you think having stronger dogs entails, then it's a good thing you have the philosophy you do. Again, DA is not what's being discussed. The dogs you're describing (barking at each other, breaking up fights all day, fine w/no other pets) sound like rather weak individuals, honestly.
The fact is when you select for BREEDING animals and not PETS, you are looking for different traits...when you end up with several dogs who possess the same traits, guess what? They don't always see eye to eye. When you select for tenacity, strength of character, confidence, etc. what happens if they should decide they each want the same thing and there is only one to go around? You have 2 dogs fighting( to the death), if you'll allow it. Same dogs are just fine passing by each other casually, as they do all the time. But allowing them to run together would be amateurish, naive, foolish, and just plain stupid.
Why deprive myself of the great experience of owning these dogs when it's soooooo easy just to keep certain ones away from certain others for precautionary reasons? That's all I'm saying.
Pass my day breaking up fights? Barking? If that's what you think having stronger dogs entails, then it's a good thing you have the philosophy you do. Again, DA is not what's being discussed. The dogs you're describing (barking at each other, breaking up fights all day, fine w/no other pets) sound like rather weak individuals, honestly.
The fact is when you select for BREEDING animals and not PETS, you are looking for different traits...when you end up with several dogs who possess the same traits, guess what? They don't always see eye to eye. When you select for tenacity, strength of character, confidence, etc. what happens if they should decide they each want the same thing and there is only one to go around? You have 2 dogs fighting( to the death), if you'll allow it. Same dogs are just fine passing by each other casually, as they do all the time. But allowing them to run together would be amateurish, naive, foolish, and just plain stupid.
Why deprive myself of the great experience of owning these dogs when it's soooooo easy just to keep certain ones away from certain others for precautionary reasons? That's all I'm saying.
by Prager on 12 September 2010 - 15:09
Jenni 78 you made me laugh! Fish! That is good.
July 9000
yes you are right. You can do what ever you want. And I am not facetious. It just rubbed me the wrong way the way you said it. you don't fit..you're out!!
But consider this if you breed. In nature only the strongest, and most dominant breed and survive. If you eliminate these types of dogs from breeding program then what will you get?
In few generations you will get lethargic, none protective dogs with none or little territoriality and with personality of a basset hound. I, on the other hand, like working, protective, territorial, but obedient, discriminative, alert, investigative and packing order respecting GSD who can kick ass.
Hans
http://www.alpinek9.com
July 9000
yes you are right. You can do what ever you want. And I am not facetious. It just rubbed me the wrong way the way you said it. you don't fit..you're out!!
But consider this if you breed. In nature only the strongest, and most dominant breed and survive. If you eliminate these types of dogs from breeding program then what will you get?
In few generations you will get lethargic, none protective dogs with none or little territoriality and with personality of a basset hound. I, on the other hand, like working, protective, territorial, but obedient, discriminative, alert, investigative and packing order respecting GSD who can kick ass.
Hans
http://www.alpinek9.com
by july9000 on 12 September 2010 - 16:09
The post is about a dog killing another one!! I tought that is what we were talking about!!
You said that is why kennel and chains and etc..were invented..So I was on the impression that you had some DA behaviors..sorry..misunderstood your post.
I absolutly understand that when selecting dogs for breeding you look for different things depending on the females you have. I usually keeps females here..unless there is an exceptionnal male. And this male usually I can't breed with my own females since they are related. So most of the time we go outside to breed and get what we want.
Like I said I train them individually...I rarely throw balls or stuff that can cause fights when they are loose together. We go hiking or skijoring or do activities that do not involved things that they can be possessive about..I'm not stupid, I don't do things to provoke a fight.
I do understand your point Jenni. I don't think having strong dogs means breaking fights..like I said most of the DA cases I've seen we're weak dogs..not strong ones. I'm a pretty strong headed person myself and I usually end up with dogs that ressemble me..just like yourself I guess..
You said that is why kennel and chains and etc..were invented..So I was on the impression that you had some DA behaviors..sorry..misunderstood your post.
I absolutly understand that when selecting dogs for breeding you look for different things depending on the females you have. I usually keeps females here..unless there is an exceptionnal male. And this male usually I can't breed with my own females since they are related. So most of the time we go outside to breed and get what we want.
Like I said I train them individually...I rarely throw balls or stuff that can cause fights when they are loose together. We go hiking or skijoring or do activities that do not involved things that they can be possessive about..I'm not stupid, I don't do things to provoke a fight.
I do understand your point Jenni. I don't think having strong dogs means breaking fights..like I said most of the DA cases I've seen we're weak dogs..not strong ones. I'm a pretty strong headed person myself and I usually end up with dogs that ressemble me..just like yourself I guess..
by july9000 on 12 September 2010 - 16:09
Bingo Prager...That is why I go outside for breeding!! I don't eliminate that from my breeding program...I think it is essential parts of beig a GSD.
When I said you don't fit in..you're out..I didn't mean from my breeding program..I said from my kennel. And I use those dogs for breeding if I feel they should be bred.
Last time I've checked..there was only 24 hours in a day..If I kept every dogs I wanted for my own pleasure I would have a lot of dogs and that means a lots of hours training and taking care for each of them...I do have to work to make a living..I have two vet clinic to take care of and that in itself takes a great portion of my time..Having dogs that I can put together makes taking care of them a lot easier for me. They have a 3 acres land that is fenced so they are outside most of the time together when we are working..After a 13 hours shift..i'm exausted, but they did have all day to run and do wathever they wanted instead of running around and going crazy in a run (like I've seen so many times in some friends kennel) chasing their tails or barking at the other dog beside..or being crated all day. (not that there is anything wrong with that!).
That is why I need dogs that get along..it is just easier for me!
When I said you don't fit in..you're out..I didn't mean from my breeding program..I said from my kennel. And I use those dogs for breeding if I feel they should be bred.
Last time I've checked..there was only 24 hours in a day..If I kept every dogs I wanted for my own pleasure I would have a lot of dogs and that means a lots of hours training and taking care for each of them...I do have to work to make a living..I have two vet clinic to take care of and that in itself takes a great portion of my time..Having dogs that I can put together makes taking care of them a lot easier for me. They have a 3 acres land that is fenced so they are outside most of the time together when we are working..After a 13 hours shift..i'm exausted, but they did have all day to run and do wathever they wanted instead of running around and going crazy in a run (like I've seen so many times in some friends kennel) chasing their tails or barking at the other dog beside..or being crated all day. (not that there is anything wrong with that!).
That is why I need dogs that get along..it is just easier for me!
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