The Bottleneck of the Century - Only one bloodline left! - Page 9

Gustav,

I never said Quanto was better than Mutz.  But VERY similar. I disagree that the showlines that have him lined in the back are not performance dogs. You seem to catagorize all show lines a poor performers. That is a mistake. They are not ALL poor performers and the ones who DO have good work and character  will have, more often than not, Quanto and many times Mutz also,  lined in the background.

Debby

No doubt selective breeding for specific traits is a powerful tool, Debby. I really like your last post especially the second paragraph.

BTW does anyone know the actual number of foundation dogs and do today's showlines and workinglines all go back to the same dogs or not? Just curious is all.

How do I figure the COI of a dog?

Vickie

www.PowerHausKennels.com

Vicky, you need to buy the software. Scroll up this thread to Louise's second post where she listed some links. Most I know use Breed Mate.

Blitzen,

I believe the answer has to yes they all go back to the same foundation dogs. But they started to gravitate and divide on the lines fairly early on, from what I understand.

Debby

sorry duplicate...

Blitzen,

There were approx 15, more females than males, although the registry wasnt closed at that time and more where added, of these 12 some were ancestors of Horand, others progeny were mated to him or his progeny or his decendants

I am not sure when they closed the registry.

In the UK the male lines were:

Southwold Wolf male                                                                                                                                                                          Roland > Pollux > Kastor > Horand Grafrath > Hecktor Schwaben > Roland Park > Hussan Park > Visar Park > Southwold Wolf.

Deal of Ponthieu male line                                                                                                                                                                    Rolland>Pollux - Fritz  V Schwenningen SZ20 - > Pax Brenztal > Luchs Hermaringen > Artur Wurtenberg > Deal Ponthieu

Flott v. Winnfeld male line
Roland > Pollux > Kastor > Horand Grafrath > Hektor Schwaben > Pilot > Wolf Balingen > Graf Eberhard Hohen Esp > Munko Boll > Horst Boll > Jokel Hallberg > Flott v. Winnfeld


Rolf v.d. Schoneyg male line:
Roland > Pollux > Kastor > Horand Grafrath > Hektor Schwaben > Heinz Starkenburg > Roland Starkenburg > Guntar Uckermark > Ajax Hohenstein > Apollo Hunenstein > Tell Hainberg > Rolf v.d. Schoneyg

Male line Arno v. Schwalbennest
Roland> Pollux> Kastor> Horand> Hektor>Pilot > Wolf Balingen > Graf Eberhard Esp > Munko Boll > Horst Boll > Nores Kriminalpolizei > Arno v Schwalbennest
 

Male Line Allah v Rolandsbogen
Rolland >Pollux > Kastor> Horand> Hektor>Heinz Starkenburg > Roland Starkenburg > Hettel Uckermark > Alex Westfalenheim > Allah v Rolandsbogen

 

cont:

Orto Simplon

Roland>Pollux> Kastor> Horand> Hektor> Beowolf> Jokel Schwetzingen> Rolf Karolingen

As you can see 5 predominant male lines but 4 go back to the same dog

 Since this is being discussed at the same time as the Sieger Show I think it'd be interesting to know the COI of the top dogs there.

- Susan

Debby, name me a showline dog that is known for producing consistent performance dogs. Now when I say performance dogs I mean something that can be quantified or else its just somebodies opinion. Dogs like Orry, Troll, Asko, Jago, etc, have consistently produced dogs that have perfomed and were performers. Czech dogs like Grim, Tom, Norbo, Cordon, have produced performance dogs and many police dogs "consistently" that again the working qualities can be quantified. Now between Sport trials and real work venues, show me a showline that has consistently produced dogs that people in these venues are seeking. People are not dumb, if the dog works at a "HIGH"  level and produces dogs that work at a high level they will use them regardless of origin. Who are these lines and where are they performing to substantiate your point??