Ethics - Page 1

Pedigree Database


by patrishap on 29 October 2004 - 00:10

(1)What is view to mating brother to sister? (2)Or,toward Breeder that, upon return of defective pup, instead of refunding purchase price and without prior agreement insists (as only option) that it be replaced with one from future litter? I ask in that an Australian Breeder/Judge/Surveyor sold me a pup with chronically over-shot jaw (from a brother-sister mating), refused to refund cost upon its return, and insisted a pup be accepted in lieu from a mating yet to occur. But, once reluctantly so agreed (verbal as she refused to commit terms to writing), later denied this agreement ever existed, and, subsequently needed to be brought before civil Tribunal for retrieval of original purchase money.

by Charlie Ivory on 29 October 2004 - 00:10

Well, 1) Although I consider my sister attractive,being intimate with her never crossed my mind,nevermind having children.Not only is it against the law but I think that is pushing Inbreeding to the limit and then some. 2)Sir to daughter is more common, My feelings are the same on that as the above. 3)I would write it off as a loss and lesson learned. 4) Ethics?I think you know the answer to that by now.

by Whizzie on 29 October 2004 - 01:10

(1) mating brother to sister is BAD NEWS! (2) Without prior agreement don't expect anything (and from such a mating; did you pay very little money?) Poor pup, to be passed from pillar to post. Not it's fault that it was brought into this world. WHY did you BUY the pup? Just my view!

by patrishap on 29 October 2004 - 01:10

Thanks Charlie. Your healthy attitude to sister is admirable. How common, asking as novice, is this sort of thing though? (in this arena, rather than the human one ,that is!)

by patrishap on 29 October 2004 - 01:10

Thanks Whizzie. We were new herein and it was one of our first pup purchases. We figured that if we couldn't trust an Approved Judge to do 'right thing', who the heck could we trust! Returning the pup was one of hardest things we ever did! We had no choice --- poor thing couldn't even chew harder foods properly once jaws became drastically misaligned! No, we paid good price indeed!

by wildthing on 29 October 2004 - 03:10

hi Do Not cross sister to brother ever no matter how nice this is inbreeding of the finest if that is what you like? Line breeding do not go past no 3 and you will be totally safe, told to me by my German friend. It is so riska to breed too close and especially brother to sister this is ridiculous for cripples and God knows what.??? Breed for the standard from the SV and follow the guidlines and u will be ok and have no HD if hips and elbows are done and fine and dandy. I know this is wrong and could tell some horrow stories I would rather now even with Halloween here. It is discraseful and crippling to the puppies in question. Go buy another female to use. Be ethnic in your breeding program and do not breed junk dogs if pure German then fine if not fine, say so, so not lie to people that they are when in fact they are half breeds. Keep within the pure Standards of our Great Breed and breed with a good conscience. God Bless Jill

by Kougar on 29 October 2004 - 06:10

Jill???????? Pat????? "Wildthing" ??? Your German "friends" are not too knowledgable. The SV standards do not allow closer than 2-3, and HD can occur no matter what the parent's status. 2 clear dogs can produce HD, whole litters can have HD while both parents are OFA or 'a' normal. The SV standards require schutzhund titles and koer classing for puppies to have regular or pink registration papers. There are still dogs who are bred to THIS standard who end up wiht HD. There are many "pure German" dogs who are not breedworthy. They are fine for pets, but ethical breeders do not breed dogs just because they are imports or because the grandparents had titles or were known. It is the parents who need credentials.

by Charlie Ivory on 29 October 2004 - 07:10

If you ask me hips are nothing more then a crap shoot.........I don't think anyone can really even say for SURE what causes it.I know OFA Penn Hip la la la la........It all comes down to this, you got what you got, good bad or otherwise.......I would say it might lessen the likely hood of developing CHD but I would not bet the house on it......We are talking abot a mix of medical science and luck, hell, we can not find a cure for the common cold,your going to predict hips and their quality 2-3 years down the road?That is pretty close to being God

by patrishap on 29 October 2004 - 08:10

Thanks Kougar, Good info - didn't know about SV no-closer-than 2-3 standard. Here's question to you and Charlie Ivory : How is it possible for one side of hip to have perfect score , and yet for the other to be damned awful?


by Brittany on 29 October 2004 - 10:10



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