Von Hayden Shepherds refuses to send paperwork - Page 7

I register my litters when they are about three weeks old the latest for that reason and post it on my website. 
So the new owners or potential buyers can check with AKC about the veracity of the registration.  

http://kerschberger.com/  scroll down so you can see what I'm taking about.  

Frankly, I find that too many people don't ask enough questions nor do enough of their own reading. 

Of course, my guess is that the breeder in question sells cheaply priced pups.
The money I spend on raw feeding alone for a litter of 8 pups is about $600 for that duration,
The chips are included, life time pre paid
The cleaning materials about $25 a week so they dont roll around in sawdust

My pups do not get chipped until their vet ck up, I bring the chips, they do the implant

Doesn't matter when they leave - the day they leave is when the new owner gets the akc
registration to their name, not a day earlier not a day later.   Why, because Its happened
that I registered a pup before shipping and there was a change of plans where the buyer
had to wait for the next litter, and I was stuck getting them to sign the pup back over to me
and spending the extra $ and inconvenience for all that.   live and learn...

yes, RayLind, I also have DNA registered with AKC, even those Dams born here in the USA for
which its not required.  

Another thing all breeders who want to be reputable should offer upfront

I'd like to say you get what you pay for, but that is not entirely true in a lot of high priced breeders
cases either, it really is up to the buyer to be bold and ask for the proof upfront, or move on when
a breeder makes up excuses. 

Yes do file a complaint with AKC however, they may not ever have registered any dog with AKC so
they can not do anything at that point.  

Kerschberger, perhaps you ought to do some homework before you talk smack about the breeder in question.  The breeder in question does not sell 'cheaply priced pups', but by the same token, the price that's established by any breeder doesn't automatically reflect the amount or quality of care the dogs receive, either.  You can easily find "spare cash" breeders who do no more than the bare minimum for the dam or the pups, yet still set their prices at $1800 and up...so that's not indicative of anything but how much a seller thinks the market will bear.

At no time has the quality of her dogs been an issue, nor how they are cared for while they are still with her--the issue was one of a lapse in the provision of the registration paperwork, but even more so the lack of response the buyer of the dog was encountering after having been patient for several months.  I don't excuse the breeder for the paperwork issue or the deaf ear that the buyer seemed to be getting, because yes, while things DO happen, it didn't interfere with the breeding of additional litters, revamping websites, posting to Facebook, etc., so it shouldn't have stopped the registration of a single-pup litter.  But Von Hayden DOES produce very nicely bred working line GSDs, and if a friend asked me about getting a dog from them, I wouldn't advise against it--I'd just caution that they should ask to see a copy of the registration paperwork BEFORE they set their hearts on a puppy and handed over any money.

"But Von Hayden DOES produce very nicely bred working line GSDs, and if a friend asked me about getting a dog from them, I wouldn't advise against it--I'd just caution that they should ask to see a copy of the registration paperwork BEFORE they set their hearts on a puppy and handed over any money."


Absolutley super advice for anyone buying a puppy! Not just from this specific kennel, but any kennel.

Yes, import litters can take longer to register, but if the breeder gets the ball rolling and can provide copies of application for foreign registration etc, that should at the least set the buyer in a better path to getting those papers. It never ceases to amaze me how slow some breeders can be with paperwork. But boy they want that puppy paid for in full before they hand it over. Has to be a meeting in the middle somewhere!

Potential buyers should contact AKC to confirm paperwork has been started etc. Make sure the sales contract notes the fact the puppy will be AKC individually registered, and a provision for what should happen should the breeder not come through with said paperwork in a timely manner (ie: by the time the puppy is 12 weeks old for domestic bred, maybe 6mos for import bred) etc. SO, in short, if the breeder doesn't supply the papers, they refund your purchase price etc..at least cover your own @ss and make sure you as a buyer has recourse.
It's funny how most German breeders can get the paperwork to American buyers quicker than some American breeders...
In this electronic age, copies of everything can be sent (and confirmed with the registering body during business hours) in minutes.

Once again, congrats!

I will continue to refer potential puppy buyers to Kim.

i purchased a 5 month old partially trained & socialized dog from them last month and am also having trouble getting papers from them.  dog was delivered and based upon prior dealings with the prior owner of vh shepherds over 10 years ago and their reputation, we accepted the dog without anything.  we are having lots of trouble with the dog. it is making a poor transition and is acting timid and not well socialized.

the only thing i have received since the purchase was a rabies & vaccination certificates.  i have received no other paper work. they told me to get AKC papers, we would have to pay them another $20.

Uh-oh.  If you were already told you'd have to pay an additional $20 for the AKC papers, then exactly what papers ARE you thinking should be forthcoming?  The AKC papers are the registration papers, and if the dog was represented to you to be an AKC-registered dog, then you shouldn't have to pay an additional anything for the papers--an AKC registered dog's papers go with the dog in the same way a car's title goes with the car...a seller can't charge you an extra fee for the car title! 

I don't think this dog is a good fit for the environment he's being asked to live in, and it would be best if he went back to the breeder, and you selected a much more laid-back dog instead.

i was told when dog was delivered that all paperwork would be forwarded by mail, including AKC registration.  when they delivered him, they showed up with nothing - not even a bill of sale, which i thought was very odd.   i have emails discussing him and the sale. based upon their reputation and prior dealings, i trusted them. when i sent the reminder about the paperwork, then they said, i needed to pay another $20.  

after the trouble we have been having with the dog , the fact that many think he is not a GS, seeing this posting, and not getting very much response from the breeder, we are starting to worry .

Who has told you that he isn't a GSD?  FWIW, I was in Home Depot yesterday with my longstock coated, West German showline, black and red female, and had two people tell me (a) he's beautiful, and (b) he's not a purebred German Shepherd, is he?  Putting aside the fact that SHE has a very feminine head and structure and should never be mistaken for a male, the only things I can account for the 'not purebred' comments were the longstock coat, and the fact that she's moderate in size--she's only about 65#, and stands 25" (64 cm)...the folks around here expect GSDs to be 100# and 30" at the shoulder. 

Call me crazy, but I don't think I'd ever buy in to a breeder delivering a puppy to me, at least not unless I'd been to THEIR place first and seen not only the dogs, but the surroundings.  Not that it's true in this instance, but 'will deliver' always makes me wonder what they don't want their buyers to see....

In this situation, however, I think the extra $20 for the AKC papers is moot, because this pup should go back and the breeder should either replace him with a mellower pup, or refund your monies if she doesn't have a mellower dog that's suitable for your specifications....so you'd be returning the papers to her anyway.

i had a litter one time were i had to wait for the stud dog to get his AKC papers as he was an import  from germany so i wrote up a letter for each buyer that paper work would be sent when i have receive them and they were when the pups were 4 months old.
i hate not having the paper work when they are ready to go as i dont like to do it that way , its not fair to the buyer.
i hope you do get your paper work.

hexe, you are absolutely right about checking them out and going to visit. i was a little leary and if i hadnt had past dealings with the prior owner (present owner's mom). as noted, they were previously out of NY and they had moved 9 hours away. the last dog we had from the prior owner of this breeding outfit was one of those really special ones. we are actually on the fence about returning the dog. my husband and the dog have a strong bond. even though it has only been 3 weeks, it would already break our hearts to not keep the dog. i have a another post asking for thoughts about w/not we should keep the puppy and explain some of the behaviors. we paid extra for a partially trained highly socialized dog that gets along with kids and all other animals. we live in a town with sidewalks and lots of foot, paw and exercisers and we are scaring people. at this point, we are unsure as to what kind of dog we would get from them, since this was suppose to be one of their most social dogs. in addition, they will only give us credit for another dog and won't give money back. we on on dog trainer #2 who believes that the dog is fearful and not been socialized. trainer #1 who trains seeing eye dogs indicated that he would be very hard to work with in that he was not responsive to correction type training. he has funny ears, and a kind of stripped tan and black markings. he is beautful and many folks stop to ask what kind of dog he is. the trainer believes that he is part something else b/c of his head shape and ears. can see him on their facebook page. https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.300472946656582.61958.106800742690471&type=1