EPI Enzyme - Page 3

Thanks again for all the advice. I will do my best with the resources to get him to health. 

As far as the EPI list goes...cautious I can understand...rude I can not.   But  agree we should all want to help out for the greater good of the animal which is why i was a litle taken back by the one email I received.  The other moderator is a gem, she is really helping me out.  She organized for someone to send him enzyme's straight away. 

Karmen

 

Good for your Karmen, can't wait to see some pics of the dog.   

We have a GSD in our Schutzhund club with E.P.I. and is doing really well since being switched to a raw diet. 

Amazing how some folks can be so rude!  Where I work we don't see any GSD's with EPI, but we do see other breeds with it.  Most of those use Pancreazyme (sp?) powder. 

TAMU does currently have EPI in GSD's as one of their current studies.  This is from that website.  Good for them for suggesting a raw diet!

EPI is a genetically linked condition where the pancreas becomes severely atrophied. It is most commonly seen in German Shepherd Dogs but increasingly occurs in other breeds as well. While manageable, it places a steep financial and emotional burden on dog owners. EPI Dogs' food needs to be treated with enzymes (which are expensive), and many dogs also require special foods, or, preferably, a raw diet.

 

There is one guy as a moderator that has terriers of some sort and beleives he knows all there is to know about EPI and no one else knows a darn thing.  He really rubs a lot of people wrong and I wonder why they do not get rid of him. 

 

They have had people come on their not owning the dog, not knowing for sure who the breeder is and bashing the breeder.  Then the breeder hears about it and makes waves.  This guy wants no waves, esp from GSD people.   So he makes these rules and sticks to them black and white, no compassion.

it is rumored he is overwieght, gay and very unhappy (hope I don't get sued!).  He is why I do not post there anymore.  You cannpot learn if you are not open to new ideas and theories.  Not all dogs respond to the therapy the same and I really beleive there are stages to EPI and that the treatment can vary depending on the degree of pancreatic atrophy.  I think that a dog cought early and given good enzyme support can help maintain some natural function and be maintatined better than one that has a completely deteriorated organ.  In the case of other breeds that may have the condition because of chronic pancreatitis rather than genetic/congenital pancreatic atrophy, they may need a different approach.

Good luck to you and the rescue pup. 

If anyone is looking for a neat christmas gift, there is a company that sells wine with a special EPI lable.  profit from the sales go to EPI research:

 

http://www.dogs4acause.org/index.php?pr=love

There are also two wines that help support service dogs.

 

Hello,

I was just wondering if anyone has an update on this shelter dog with EPI?

Did he ever get his needed enzymes from Karmen? I hope he got adopted. Karmen you are an ANGEL for helping this dog!

I remember this post last month and was curious about an update? This dog has been in my thoughts and prayers.

 

Hodie:

I have been looking at many bags of dog food at the stores to try and find a food with less than 9% fat content.  Thank you for the information.

I could only find Solid Gold Wolfking with 9% crude fat and 22 % protein, so figured this had to be better for her than the Royal Canin.   What is everyones opinion on supplementing with some can food.  Natural Balance Duck and Potato formula has 4% fat and Chicken Soup for the Dog Lovers soul also has 4%.  Also on these foods they list the fat content at a minimum % of fat.  Is this good enough?  They do not list a maximum.

She seems to be doing well on the food, viokase and tylan powder and she does not feel like a bag of bones anymore.  Still very thin, but not so painfully thin. 

Her energy level has also improved and she is beginning to improve on her jumps and retrieves.  I am starting to see the old Molly return.

Thank you for all the good advice.  It is very much appreciated.

Cheryl

 

Karmen, You can order enzymes from K9-Epi.com. I have ordered from here for years and Diane is very reliable. She orders directly from American Labs and you do not have to be a member of the yahoo group. Or you can order directly from American Lab yourself as previously posted. One thing also to look for in dog food is low fiber content as well less that 4%. You are doing a good thing. Lyn

Hello Everyone,

Clank has his enzymes and I bought some Diane and just the shipment in.  He had a donation of enzymes from some people on that EPI list that had contacted me privately.  He is currnetly in a foster home but still needs adopted.  The foster mom can't afford his care unless I pay for it.  I haven't seen him since she took him but teh last time I saw him he looked a little better even after a week on his enzymes and good food.  I need to ask to see him so I know he is getting better and not just existing.  The problem I have is they are not listing him as a special needs adoption dog at all.  He isn't even on their site and it bothers me because without advertising him he has NO chance of getting adopted and now that he is out of the shelter no one can see him either.  DOn't get me wrong I am glad he in in foster care but still needs to be advertised...Thanks for asking about him :)

Karmen

Hi Karmen,

I had a dog brought back to me, the owners couldnt afford the supposed treatment with the EPI Enzyme powder their vet said he needed for his condition.  I took back the puppy (10 months) and having looked at him questioned in my mind the vete.  He never had a drop of the EPI enzyme powder from that day to this.  It is still in date, the dog is in fet and brilliant condition... on a normal diet, and with no problems....... if I know where to send this powder - a full pot, I will send it, please let me know.   Regards   Mo Lakin  -  Mascani

Renofan,

If the dog is tolerating the enzyme replacement, (and that is demonstrated by better stools, meaning formed and darker color and not so voluminous) then keep doing what you are doing and give it time. It takes several weeks to gain weight for a dog who has lost it, especially if they are thin. If you change food, change and then give the dog at least a week to see how it tolerates the new diet. Stool takes a long transit time so if you feed a new food today and see loose stool today, unless the dog is having serious diarrhea, this is not the food he ingested. Give all change time for observations. And write them down at the same time of day, each day.

Baldursmom, the person who emailed me from the EPI list was a female and borderline rude and definitely officious. She felt she knew everything about the condition and everyone else is an idiot. I knew about this condition many, many years ago before it even had a name almost.

You are absolutely correct that there are degrees of this problem. A given gene may code for a faulty protein for example, that means the enzyme is weak, or sporadically produced or not produced in sufficient quantity.  In fact, I personally am convinced that there are several causes, including some dogs who have intermittant deficiency. The trick is to be absolutely certain that the problem is not because of parasites. So if I have a dog who I suspect has an enzyme issue, the very first thing I do is test them over and over and over for parasites of all kinds. Once that is ruled out, then I begin a treatment for parasites anyway, just in case. And then, slowly, over time, and being certain to allow changes to work, I begin to add or change the way the dog is fed and medicated. In this manner I have been able to deal with many, many dogs over the course of 14 years doing rescue and two now of my own who need help. The worst thing most people do is change, change, change and do so too fast to allow results to be observed. The average poop for example comes out around 53 hours after ingestion in a dog. Some dogs need the replacement and still need something like metronidazole for inflammatory response in the gut.  Others need Tylan. Some need both. 

I order enzyme now also from Diane. I got my supply within about a week from payment by Paypal. The enzyme is the 6X and I plan to order the 8X next time. At this time both dogs needing it are doing well, and gaining weight. I still feed them the Royal Canin Weight Care. I have tried many other foods without success. I would encourage everyone to use Diane as she has managed to reduce the cost of the enzyme by ordering in bulk. My cost with my vet, even though she was giving it to me essentially at her cost, was simply prohibitive.

Karmen, do check whether this rescue has been checked repeatedly for parasites. Once infested, some can be terribly difficult to get rid of, and in fact, are the real culprit. Good luck. 

I asked if he was tested for parasites and they said yes but you never know with shelters.  Even if they did not sure they can catch some that are only visible at times of shedding.    It's much harder for me to keep tabs on the dog since he isn't there at the shelter.  I don't get to see him, and only get updates if I call.  

The one lady i had contact with from the list was just the same as Hodie said.  Acting like I was an idiot, speaking down to me, very condescending.  Two other members though are the ones who gave me the first two weeks of enzymes. 

Here is the animal shelter's address if you want to donate the enzymes.  Thanks :)

 

Animal Welfare League of Kosciusko County
3489 E 100 S
PO Box 1906
Pierceton, IN 46562
574-267-3008

 

I'll keep trying to get to the bottom of Clank's problem and keep everyone updated...

Karmen