It's not just a dog show - Page 3

guys, is this what a novice has to look foward to , or do you guys have advise on a place to learn the bascis as now i am more confused than when i started and if the shows are not fair then why try, or are there shows that are fair so you can really judge your dog. jusy a peaon

In my opinion, try to find one that the secretaries and people actually putting on the show do not show thier dogs in it also.  I still think that it IS more politics than anything.  JMO. 

Princess:  You should go to dog shows, watch what happens, learn and judge for yourself.  For the most part, dog shows are very fair.  Naturally, people will  disagree with a judges decision (which is basically an informed opinion).  The problems come when those people, in their dissapointment,  start tossing about accusations that cannot be proved but are damning to new comers such as yourself.  People are funny, they go to shows and want to win (nothing wrong with that), but get really mad when a judge doesn't overlook what they consider to be the minor faults of their dogs.

Princess, I think Sueincc is right.  I've showed dogs at AKC shows since 1970 and you win some, you lose some. I had the saem dog go dead last in his class of 4 one weekend and win a specialty by defeating 125  other dogs 2 weeks later. IMO the important thing is to remember that's it's just one person's opinion on that specific day. I believe you will find the breeder-judges to be the easiest to show under or not. They generally put up the type/style of dog they are known to have bred. If you have that type you would want to enter under them, if not then save your money.

Some AKC judges are political, but sooner or later it catches up with them and they stop drawing decent entries so the clubs no longer hire them. Shepherd Woman has had a bad experience with members of the show committee showing their dogs at UKC functions. That's not allowed at AKC shows. Not sure which venue you are thinking about showing in. If it's the SV shows then you hvae a whole different set of circumstances to deal with and really need to try to find yourself a good mentor who will have your best interests at heart. UKC and AKC shows are easier, you can handle your own dog if you want although it's really tough at AKC shows to win  in the GSD ring without a well-known pro handler. I usually made my decisions on which shows to enter which dog based soley on who the judge was and what I knew about him or her. I'd didn't show a large dog under a small dog judge, that sort of thing.

Have fun with your dog and good luck!

I have enjoyed showing my dog since he was a puppy.  When he was 4 months old, he won his puppy class at an All Breed AKC show.  I had never shown a dog in an AKC breed show, and I thought the experience to be very interesting.  Then we showed SV style and I learned alot there.  I think over the 4 years I have taken my dog out to shows, I have learned more about structure and the way the breed is going than I would have reading any book.  It has made me plan ahead, condition my dog, work with him, train him, keep working him, keep showing him and created an incredible bond between me and my dog.  It is like a constant building project with lots of turns and twists. It is exciting because you never know the result until the show class is over! What one does have to do is separate one's ego from the placement.  I have met some incredible people in the sport of showing dogs too.  I think it is very important that the hobby people stay in the game.  In my estimation, being able to be participant is a fun and enriching hobby.  One should however not go into it with an expectation of return of investment.  

I just want to add one thing about "politics".  My dog has no politics going for him.  His kennel name has become extinct because his breeder no longer breeds GSD's.  He was not a German import.  We had no team working with us, no mentors.  The dog achieved his titles and show ratings on his own merit, despite politics.  I hope this encourages anyone new in this sport. 

top dog, that is a very interesting statement you made about me. Tell me when have I complained about similar things and what I said. I am really interested in hearing that one. I do vent my personal disappointments when things have not gone my way - among my peers. That is quite a normal thing to do. You are not part of that group so how would you know what I say. You have also never seen me post about it, nor do I make a big stink about it elsewhere. 
I do agree that shows are not perfect. I know that and I approach it accordingly. Whenever there is room for interpretation people will occupy any space that is available to them. If I showed you 5 different breed standards from different breeds without telling what breeds they are and you were asked to draw them according to that standard, chances are the drawing of your dogs would look very different than the ideal of each breed.
I do find your conduct very unsportsman like. You apepar disrespectful, petty and spiteful. I see no German owners listed in the results page. So how can a German owner go into the ring and get his dog re-instated if no German owned dog was listed in the results? It is also not about adult dogs having sudden growth spurts. It is about respecting the decision of the judge. Would you have been happy with a G rating perhaps? That is all your KKL entitles you to. KKL and show rating are separate issues, separate events, separate judges, and one has no baring for the other, except that a minimum G needs to preceed the KKL. Then there is the hypocrisy of you sending your dog specifically to Germany to take advantage of the Germans when it suits your needs, but lo and behold you should be inconvenienced by a German on your home turf... And the hypocrisy of you accepting a KKL for life on a dog you are now telling us is oversize. I have a question for you: next SS in October, you show up with your dog, your dog stays in the ring, some other dog gets dismissed because of size. What will YOU do?

Michael10, if the Canadian Sieger Show applies the PO rules for the courage test as is done at most SSs, these rules say that a judge CAN disqualify a dog - does not say must, so yes there is room for the judges discretion - if the dog bites a body part other than the sleeve. A bite on an exposed body part such as a hand will very quickly leave clear evidence of a bite. We all know what a bite is. So lets stay real here. The judge asked to see the hand, determined there was no evidence of a bite and made his ruling accoringly. If there was no bite, no rule was broken, the decision was correct.

D.H.,

Chris

Just to clarify one point:

I was at the show and I watched the entire bite work and like most others present I saw the helper being bit in the hand. I spoke to Benoit, the helper, after the bite work was done and saw the mark on his hand. He was bit by the dog, the bite did not draw blood but he was most certainly bit. Whether right or wrong I don't know, but the judge passed the dog.

Just to clarify one point:

I was at the show and I watched the entire bite work and like most others present I saw the helper being bit in the hand. I spoke to Benoit, the helper, after the bite work was done and saw the mark on his hand. He was bit by the dog, the bite did not draw blood but he was most certainly bit. Whether right or wrong I don't know, but the judge passed the dog.