Puppy with Giardia and Coccidiosis - Advice appreciated - Page 1

My pup arrived two weeks ago. I took him to vet Tuesday and got his 12 week shots, took stool sample and everything was fine. Yesterday morning (Sunday), he didn't finish all of his food, which was a first (feeding K9 Kravings). I checked his morning poop, as usual, nothing of note. He didn't eat any lunch, and in the afternoon I saw about 5 roundworms in his poop. He was very lethargic and then he vomited, so I took him to emergency vet (weekend, normal vet closed). He vomited multiple times while we were there (over 4 hours).   His temp was elevated but not too high.   They ran tests but didn't initially determine the problem.   They gave him a shot for nausea and gave us a prescription (for nausea) and told us to monitor him and they sent him home.   We were not very happy with the vet as he really didn't know what the problem was.   We monitored him last night and I could tell his temp went up and he was more lethargic.   He then started having diarrhea (yellow liquid) so I collected it and took him back to the emergency clinic in the middle of the night, but I requested a different doctor.  This doctor did blood tests, checked to make sure he wasn't dehydrated (he lost 1 lb. since our earlier visit), which he wasnt.   His temp increased to 103.8.    They did blood tests, examined his stool, checked  for an obstruction, and did a parvo test.   They determined he did not have parvo or an obstruction, but his stool test showed Giardia and Coccidiosis.   They gave him an initial dose of Metronidazole.  Right now we returned home, but if he can't keep the medicine down or if he doesn't start eating we will have to take him back and they will run IV and keep him for monitoring.    I have been reading a lot on the forum about Giardia and it seems that is a tough think to get rid of?    Most of the posts are old, so are there any updates? How concerned should we be? He has gone 24 hours without eating (but he is drinking), so how long should we wait before going the IV route? Any advice is appreciated.

CSS

Your puppy has been treated for the Giardia with a pretty heavy duty drug. Read the side effects for metronidazole. Organ damage, brain damage, diarrhea, Just say no and give him Safeguard for goats at 1cc per 5 lbs for 10 days and you will be on top of the giardia. You have been given nothing for the coccidia. Albon, sulmet, some type of sulfur based drug is necessary to rid that. Both of these are tough to get rid of. Plan on treating again.

If you go the metro route, you may be in for a ride. Metro kills bacteria. Your dogs bacteria may get out of balance. The diarrhea will continue until your vet gives up and tells you you have a genetic problem. That's what they say when they can't fix it. What they are missing will be replenishing the bacteria with good bacteria and getting it back in balance.

Hang in there. Positive results usually happen in two or three days. Stay the course and use all the medicine.

PS: I don't think I would give him since he is a puppy anything other than the safeguard for goats at the above recommended dosage for the 5 days, give a break and re weigh and give safeguard again after 14 days break. I have never given it for a straight 10 days. 5 days consecutively, wait 2 weeks give for another 5 days. But why don't you see how he is doing after the first 5 days then reassess. Also I would give some type probiotic (plain yogurt or Kefir is OK) if he is used to dairy, otherwise find some type doggy probiotic and plan on giving that for quite a while. I had good luck with the purina probiotic powder added into the food.

Possibly raw meats are the problem?? My boy could not take the raw diets, tried all kinds of raw just could not take it. He is now 3 years old and gets kibble mixed with fresh ground turkey cooked and sometimes with some added cooked fish but it took me quite a while to figure all that out for him. Kept having blow out diarrhea. etc.

Possibly cook up some rice and ground beef, make it very dry to feed him, he will eat when he is hungry. Probably has a belly ache. When you can I would also give him a Drontal Plus tab for his weight, have to get that from your vet but wait until after the first 5 days of Safegard for goats, take in stool sample then give Drontal Plus to be sure you have covered round worms and any tape worms for good also.

Good luck try not to worry too much. Sounds like the stress of relocating, new food, worms, all at once just caught up with him, some of these guys are touchy.

Nan

Try Kochi free by Amber Technology

It may be a silly question by why safeguard for "goats" vs. the canine safeguard?

No reason, css, except it's easy to get over the counter in any farm store, and can be cheaper, depending on dosage. Giardia dosage needs to be done for about 9-10 days. I say 9 because the canine stuff comes in 3's. Kochi-Free by Amber Technology will also be effective against both protozoa but lethargy, yellow diarrhea, and a fever freak me out.

I am not happy with a puppy with a fever for giardia and coccidia, except that he was just vaccinated- vaccines could cause that, but parvo diarrhea can start yellow and 103.8 is a fever. I have never had a puppy with giardia or coccidia with a fever. In fact, that's how I decide whether I panic or go buy Safeguard :) I have also never had a puppy refuse food with either of those ailment.

THIS IS WHY ONLY HEALTHY PUPPIES SHOULD BE VACCINATED. If he had both of those things and then no doubt a round of shots (instead of just parvo/distemper like he needed), it could cause a major illness as opposed to a boisterous puppy with some diarrhea, as you typically see with protzoa.

I would recheck for parvo, personally. Another thing you can do is Paxxin (formerly Parvaid, by Amber Technologies), but check which remedies can be used together, because off the top of my head, I don't remember.

Metronidazole is harsh but if they are concerned about parvo and a false negative test, I understand it. If he definitely doesn't have parvo, then I'd stop the metro, especially if he is just a little pup.

Metronidazole slows down the digestive tract so it is used even when no infection is detected sometimes just to quiet down the GI tract. Coccidiosis is usually stress related since Coccidia are everywhere.  Every dog walking around has Coccidia in their GI tract ... it's when the get out of hand due to stress or other disease that they cause illness. The mention of a possible vaccine reaction is reasonable and likely. Stacking vaccines such as rabies and Dpv is the usual cause.  My dog Viktor is 7 years and has never been sick a day in his life that I could tell except when he got a stacked Dpv and rabies at 4 months.  One week later emergency vet, 800 dollars in x-rays and tests, nothing wrong that they could find other than vomiting and pooping liquid with blood.  Metronidazole for three days to stop the diarrhea ... recovery took 3 to 4 weeks to full health and Viktor is a strong, strong dog.  The vets will never say vaccine reaction or vaccine caused disease.

I prefer it css to doggy safeguard as lots of dogs puke up the doggy safeguard and have no problem with the liquid panacur; have used it much more often than the doggy safeguard.

My computer is crap this AM. Signing off. Nan

...Coccidiosis is usually stress related since Coccidia are everywhere.  Every dog walking around has Coccidia in their GI tract ... it's when the get out of hand due to stress....

I know that Coccidia is ramped here in the parks as our city uses reclaimed to water the grass, what i wasnt aware of is that dogs are walking around with it in their GI tracks normally. That is some good info, thanks bubbabooboo

 

Coccidia tend to be species limited. They don't infect all animals equally unlike some of the other protozoans. Many found in animals such as dogs and cats are not fond of human GI tracts and vice versa. Most healthy humans and animals can live just fine with a few coccidia but when stress weakens their host they have a party and their population grows to further weaken the host. Pups get coccidiosis more due to stress than exposure to the pathogen which by 8-10 weeks almost all pups already have in their gut. Humans have them too!